^A friend of mine actually mentioned that to me on Saturday, but I had never noticed it before.

I kind of think of them as two sides of one coin, in a way.

Think about it. Anthy's calm on the outside, extremely secretive, and very, very manipulative. Saionji, on the other hand, is almost always in a rage, wears his heart on his sleeve, and ends up being one of the most manipulated, along with insignificant duelists in the series.

He's also the first one who uses a sword on Utena, while Anthy is the last. To add to that, his physical attack on Utena fails, and Anthy's succeeds.(ouch)

They also appear to have the same hair-type. There really does seem to be a weird duality between these two characters.

Last edited by Adrasteia (03-05-2008 06:09:43 AM)

Utena mopes quite a bit when she loses her first duel, too. If it weren't for Wakaba, she might well have stayed that way for a long time; while Touga had already disposed of his own Wakaba earlier in the first arc.

Touga's color being red always reminded me of Power rangers. Red's the leader

Let's feng-shui this thread up a bit.

White- A fresh canvas -New beginings, purity and innocence.  Cleanliness  and freshness, but also cold, lifelessness and starkness.

Black- A clean slate -Mysterious and independant.  Intrigue, strength and allure, but also death, darkness and evil.

Red- Stimulating and dominant.  Not suitable for dining rooms, children's bedrooms, kitchens or workshops (Wrote that mainly because the first two amused me so).  Associated with warmth, prosperity and stimulation, but also anger, shame and hatred.

Yellow: Enlightenment and intellect, it stimulates the brain and aids digestion (That fucking EGG).  It's positive qualities are optimism, reason and decisivness, while its negative qualities are craftiness, exaggeration and rigidity.

Green:  Growth, fertility and harmony.  Restful and refreshing.  Positive qualities are optimism, freedom and balance, and it's negatives are envy and deceit.

Blue:  Peaceful and soothing and linked with spirituality, contemplation, mystery and patience.  Its positive associations are trust, faithfulness and stability.  Negatives are suspicion and melancholia.

Purple:  Encouraging vitality, purple is impressive, dignified and spiritual.  Positives associations are excitement, passion and motivation, negatives are mournfulness and force.  (This almost doesn't seem to fit, unless you think of it as the negative associations mournfulness and force having to do more with Akio, and the posistive attributes as something she obtains after Utena's revolution).

Pink:  Linked with purity of thought and has the positive association of happiness and romance with no negative characteristics.  (And it's the only one with no negative qualities.)

Orange:  A powerful and cheerful color, orange encourages communication (LULZ).  It's positive qualities are happiness, concentration and intellect, and its negative is rebelliousness. 

Brown:  Stability and weight.  Safety and elegance, but also dinginess, depression and aging.



**slightly random note.  I've always been interested in Miki and Kozue's shared theme of blue, relating to water.  They are twins, so their physical appearances reflect eachother, like images on water.   Kozue sees Miki as the innocent she once was, while Miki sees Kozue as something that only used to be innocent, her image is marred by the red lipstick and shorts that symbolize sex and sin and the clear lack of innocence.

I think alot of the character's colors represent their potential.  They are oft to show their more negative qualities until later on during the series or after their revolutions, when more of the positive elements of their colors show through.

As for the inverted colors with Saionji and Anthy's hair and eye colors...I always thought of it like this: Anthy's green eyes represent enternity, deep inside, though it is not something she expressly desires, so it is a little more hidden, it is overshadowed by her doormat personality and role as the Rosebride, hence her hair, which while up symbolizes her lack of freedom, being colored purple.

For Saionji, enternity is more overtly and openly desired, and so his hair is green, hanging down in free, flowing waves of absolute sexiness.  What I mean is, it's kinda big and flashy and out-there.  Saionji's hair demands eternity.  For his eyes, the purple might more than likely represent the more positive qualities of the color, which, in Saionji's case, are less well-known and visible to others in comparison to his "OMG ETERNITY ME WANT NAO" behavior.

I also kinda think Saionji tends to spend alot of his interactions with Anthy trying to catch her eyes.   

Gods I love Saionji.

Last edited by OnlyInThisLight (03-05-2008 07:17:32 PM)

brian wrote:

Stephanie wrote:

Anthy might be the typical female Japanese who is submissive and let's Saionji abuse her.

I'm out of my depth here but someone claimed that the Japanese ideal of womanhood is not submissiveness but uncomplaining Spartan endurance. By that measure he is not an exemplar of old-fashioned Japanese warrior virtues either, he's too flashy, too emotional, too vain, and too fickle.

I get the feeling that Anthy is not supposed to be a typical anything, she's just an outsider, mysterious and misunderstood.

Somehow those green eyes of hers seem to evoke both great depth and great power and a prematurely old soul. Green is the most perfect color for them to be. Harry Potter's eyes are green and I get the feeling that they have some of the same basic symbolism for both characters.

Well, about Saionji, during Ikuni's interview on the radio about him, he explained the Saionji slapping Anthy represents males in Japan..

So far, that's what he said..
I dunno about men being flashy there and stuff.

This may be either obvious or unrelated, but I figure I could mention it anyway.

Nanami's yellow keeps relating to the stomach in this thread. It reminded me of The Failing Revolution by Spiral Artist (http://www.ohtori.nu/analysis/07_spiral … ailing.htm). It's said that Nanami somewhat symbolizes the submissive female who likes her position, as opposed to feminists who oppose the ideal submissive-woman, or girls like Utena who just don't follow others' standards. I've thought of Nanami as a spoiled princess with her shallow prince (Touga, who's a bit shallow towards her as well as other girls, at least). I know that the yellow=stomach thing is referring more towards food/energy and digestion, but maybe the stomach may also imply the womb, and thereby childbirth? I think that exact part may be a bit lower. It's just that the ideal submissive-woman/princess doesn't mind being a baby-factory to her prince. (The cold isn't helping my choice of words...)

And more about colors... Isn't black "the color of detail"? A lot of the girls and boys who only get 0.00001 seconds of screentime in SKU have black hair/eyes, and a few have at least a dark brown/something color of hair and eyes. This doesn't include people like Wakaba and Keiko. It may have just been a sort of laziness with the animation, but the other students that make up Ohtori school are just there to fill it up. They are trapped in the illusion just like the main cast, but they're not in Akio's game. They're just details to make the main picture look pretty or whole.

I'm kind of surprised to see that no one's mentioned that red is the color of blood yet. I'm not sure what that would symbolize of Touga or his rose, but it's easy to connect to Anthy's dress and Akio's car. Anthy is Akio's scapegoat. She's the target for the gazillion-swords-of-hate. Being stabbed a gazillion times = bleeding = blood. Anthy's dress, I've heard before, symbolizes a "trophy wife," or a wife who's just there to look pretty, which could also lead to suffering (hence the swords being pulled out of her, as opposed to in. Also, Anthy wore red even when Akio was still Dios. Maybe she was playing a trophy wife of sorts). Her being a witch may also indicate why people would love to stab her, for taking away Dios (in the movie: having sex with Dios?) or for doing witch-like things. Anyway, it leads up to the swords.

Akio's car can mean several things (probably depending on the situation the car is in, too). In the movie, the car was just there and not doing much. When Akio was making the moves on Utena, it's red color may have just indicated "let's get it on," but it could also indicate that Utena's morality is being hurt by the incident. Hurt=bleeding=blood, but that might be going a bit too far. I think Razura (I THINK!) may have said that his car symbolizes a sort of motivation or a transportation to getting what is desired by the duelists. The journey to getting what one wants would lead to hurting and suffering, which may be represented by blood or red. This may also be true for any red in the Dueling Arena.

I wish I could say more, but it's cold. Still, even though the interpretations of green have been directed at Saiounji and Anthy thus far, what about the green on the uniforms? The girls have green colars and skirts, and the boys wear all green. This is, though, for the "ordinary" boys. And(!), if we're talking about Anthy's eyes, would it necessarily also refer to Akio/Dios?

I love this thread. It makes me and even in this weather.

dabouse1 wrote:

Still, even though the interpretations of green have been directed at Saiounji and Anthy thus far, what about the green on the uniforms? The girls have green colars and skirts, and the boys wear all green. This is, though, for the "ordinary" boys. And(!), if we're talking about Anthy's eyes, would it necessarily also refer to Akio/Dios?

Maybe it's just my own quirk but deep green eyes are very evocative of the Earth with all that can imply. I think that's a reason why certain characters are given green eyes but it's hard to say for sure.

There is a lot of botanical imagery in Utena and the pale green of the ordinary students shows them as young growing things. Maybe the bright colors of the major characters show their "specialness" but also makes them lurid.

Giovanna wrote:

Red by its most common definiton is a passionate color, so it's odd that red appears prominently in the show's least passionate characters.

Wasn't it you or Yasha that said SKU is like a semi-dark tale disguised with prettiful colors? Maybe it's Iku's way of being ironic, or even mocking those who pretend to be something they're not. (For Touga, it being chivilrous. Anthy: a princess instead of a witch. Akio: a prince.) Other than that, I've no idea how to explain Touga's wearing red, unless it's just another kink for "I'm sexy," since red is considered to be a very sexy color.

brian wrote:

Maybe it's just my own quirk but deep green eyes are very evocative of the Earth with all that can imply. I think that's a reason why certain characters are given green eyes but it's hard to say for sure.

There is a lot of botanical imagery in Utena and the pale green of the ordinary students shows them as young growing things. Maybe the bright colors of the major characters show their "specialness" but also makes them lurid.

The quickest thing I could respond with is that both Anthy and Akio are stuck in their own purgatory -- or, in other words, they can't go to a higher place/heaven like Utena easily could because they are trapped in Ohtori. They both seem to do this willingly, so...they are earthbound. As is Saiounji and the other characters, but I think Akio and Anthy are in a deeper pile of shit, respectively.

And Wakaba's BlackRose episode was all about her angsting over how unspecial she and other girls are, compared to Utena and the Council. If I remember correctly, she was wearing pure black -- whilst the other Black Rose Duelists were wearing dark shades, but not neccessarilly black. What's more, I think Akio mentioned something about gardens=schools once. I forget, though I'd agree with that.

dollface wrote:

But Touga's passion is something that, while debatable, can't really be shown as completely unreal. This is especially true of movie!Touga and manga!Touga. Although I certainly don't ship Touga and Utena, I don't doubt that at least some of his feelings for her were real, and his passion for the revolution was not merely an act. ... The passion and devotion he shows to her (at least in the later half of the series) may have been showy, but it wasn't just for show. By the end of his run, Touga wasn't looking for personal gain in Utena, he was looking for an honest-to-goodness princess. Even if it could have helped him to conceal that passion, he wouldn't have been able to.

I like this a lot because I mostly agree with what it says about Touga. :-)  Touga doesn't need to affect red and what it symbolizes by wearing it.  He is, or will be, naturally.

We have the passion/love side of red and the scarlet letter/blood side of red.  Interesting if you apply "the scarlet letter" to Touga....

Kanae?  I always saw as orange representing unfufillment, like Juri, and a white scarf for innocence  and as a reference to the white lillies in her black rose duel.  The green in her hair can represent feelings of jealousy and dislike towards Anthy and Utena for getting to spend so much more time with her fiance.  Like her, it's repressed --pale, overlooked.  Barely there unless you take the time to actually look at her.


Overall, Kanae's hair is meant to look blonde to anyone not paying her any attention, and is very full and beautiful.  Just the happy, blonde, trophy-wife-to-be.

Last edited by OnlyInThisLight (03-25-2008 08:33:57 PM)

Coco Melancholy wrote:

Also any views on Kanae's colours? Rose?? Hair? Eyes? Clothes? Duelist outfit?

In her regular outfit, Kanae wraps herself in different colors while most other characters wear either school or dueling uniforms. She doesn't have obvious color patterns like the other Duelists. Perhaps this schema shows that Kanae constantlty bends over backwards and changes her personality to fulfill other people's whims.

What struck me from the first moment I saw Kanae, though, is how she immediately reminded me of a broken baby bird. I watched the rest of the episode just waiting for something bad to happen to her, because it seemed obvious that something would. It must've been her overall pale color schema. Pallid skin, almost-white-hair and scarves, ordinary big brown eyes...even her orange dress wasn't that bright. In fact, the dress is perhaps reminiscent of Juri. Both characters desire love, miracles, and above all, strength to overcome their weaknesses. Of course, Kanae doesn't nearly have the backbone Juri does, so she's considerably worse at getting what she wants, even in the Dueling Arena. I don't hate Kanae, but she's definitely one of the more pitiful characters in the series.

Last edited by Nights1stStar (04-20-2009 09:52:11 AM)