I think racism hmmm...what can I say about it? Logically it makes no sense. And I think, people deep down know this, race does not make you any smarter,faster,better looking, nor does it give you any upper hand in the works of the universe. People who have these prejudices tend to have insecurity with themselves, and in human nature, they project it onto other people. Also people fear what they can not understand, and racism is derivative of fear. There is a resurgence of hate groups now, and it does not shock me, we live in scary, and fearful times. People are using religion and God's name to do horrible,horrible things to others. I've never understood racism, how a skin tone or a ethnicity can make, can lead someone to thinking that they are better than this person or that this person needs to be hated, for something they have no control over. It makes me sick when I think about the crimes committed over the years, and the continuation of nasty stereotypes and racist ideologies (Don Imus I'm talking to you).

But, we can combat racism with making sure that the generations after us, learn from history and learn what not to do. If we pass onto children, that race means diddly squat, perhaps we have a chance. But so much of it has a lot to do with personal introspection.

sorry getting preachy there.

Racism in New Zealand isn't always obvious; it depends on where you live and to some degree how you live (although New Zealand technically doesn't have a class system, most of us come from the UK and/or Europe, and although most of our ancestors would have likely been working class it was a system pretty bloody well ingrained in all levels of society; personally I noticed it most in Christchurch, which was a) owned by Oxford University and b) described as "more English than England"). There are two major ethnic groupings in New Zealand -- Maori, who are not "pure-blooded" by any stretch of the imagination any longer (hence why people whiter than I am -- and on a good day I look like Alucard's new best friend -- can claim benefits from the government based solely on tenuous links to Maori ancestry), and Pakeha. Pakeha is a Maori term generally applied to Caucasians of European descent (and yes, I am Pakeha), but it actually means anyone not Maori. There has always been tension between Maori and pakeha, from the first meeting at sea between Abel Tasman and a group of Maori (resulting in some fatalities due to a complete clash of cultures) to now, where our national "independence" day is closer to "National Protest Day" in which it's not a good day unless someone's made the prime minister cry. I won't go into intense detail -- it's a short amount of history, about a hundred and fifty years worth, but I am no historian AND I never really grasped the finer details at school anyway -- but basically? England came up with the Treaty of Waitangi to a) protect the "natives" and b) stop the French annexing Banks Peninsula, and then proceeded to mistranslate the Maori version and completely bollocks up all their obligations therein. Because of this there is always a degree of tension that could be called "racism" between Maori and Pakeha, and as a pakeha with no known iwi or waka connections AND being from the south of the south island (meaning a) I lived in an area mostly devoid of Maori connections because it was never traditionally a permanent home of any Maori tribes because it's bloody freezing most of the time and b) my culture is mostly Celtic-derived because the Scots were the only folk crazy enough to colonise there) I admit I have very little understanding of things like Ngai Tahu. Although I have cried my eyes out at Te Papa because that is where they keep a copy of the Treaty in question, and as a representation of the original that has been burnt, ripped, torn, water-damaged and allowed to grow mold...you can see why people get upset. But then, given we are all New Zealanders and we all love the country as much as one another, we pakeha don't like to be told we don't have the capability to feel the land and its life the way the Maori do. We might not believe in taniwha, exactly, but I lived in New Zealand from birth until early last year, and my heart? Is embedded in that country. I am a New Zealander. We all are. I hate the way we all fight over "ownership" of the country because if you live and love Aotearoa then you are New Zealand. That's all there is to it.

It's not just the traditional Maori/Pakeha divide, though. We have a lot of Asian immigration -- and by "Asian" a New Zealander means Thai, Chinese, Japanese, Malaysian and Korean immigrants; we get very confused by the British use of the same term, I can assure you -- and we do have in certain areas -- say, the North Island in general and Christchurch in the South -- a lot of resentment over it. Why? Probably because of the perceived "they don't speak our language" and "they're stealing all our jobs" bullshit (which isn't unusual, as in the UK we're having a lot of that...and I'm probably part of it, being a foreigner myself, but I get away with it because a) I speak English natively and b) Australians and Kiwis are trusted employees, apparently). The Pacific Islanders also make up a huge proportion of the population of Auckland and the Bay of Plenty/Islands, and their tendency to be in the lower socio-economic bracket (thereby receiving state benefits) can cause those of us with regular jobs and whatnot to feel resentment on the "we work to support people who weren't even born here" front. (Although Australians feel that way about us when we go over there to leech off their dole, ha ha ha...) So...er, yeah. It's an interesting topic, because I tend to find people in England assume New Zealand is a lovely country with no racial tension at all. Which makes me laugh. I've been sheltered from a lot of it -- like I said, isolated middle-class pakeha in a white-dominated province with a strong Anglo-Celtic background -- but it's very there. And it always makes me angry. I've actually decided to learn Maori when I go home, because although my father (whom I love, but always pisses me off with his comments about how the Maori are trying to "steal" back land/resources from the government when we DID fuck them over originally) says it's pointless, I don't think it is. It's a beautiful language, it's officially one of the country's languages, and it is as much a part of my heritage as bagpipes and Guinness and Cockney rhyming slang. I can sing in Maori, but I have no idea what I am saying. And this makes me cry, because when I stand in the middle of nowhere in my home country I know that Maori is as much the language of that land as is my own.

Racism pisses me off. But I know that those little puppets at Avenue Q are right, because even when we try so hard not to be, we're all a little bit racist (at the very least). The strength and sensibility comes in recognising it, and working through it. I just hope like hell that when I go back home, after seeing what life is like in England for various minoities, that I can recognise and work against it at home a whole lot better than I ever have before.

Home at last Ok people get a comfy chair because this is going to be a large post... and bring some poptarts

México or United States of Mexico/United Mexican States* is an "independent" country since 1821. Before it was Spain Colony called New Spain and before it was a mess of indigen tribes... that hated each other since then... so definitely nothing good could come out of it

Spanish Conquistadors only came to make things worse as they institutionalized racism:

*when the Spanishmen had sons in the new spain they were not considered as Spanishmen but “criollos” and even if their parents were Spanish coming from Spain they were still lesser important citizens as they didn’t had the same privileges as Spanishmen coming from the Iberic Peninsula.
Indians or Indigenas: the largest population group at first that went decreasing in recent times. This classification include Aztecs/Mexicas, mayas, purepechas, mixtecas, tlaxcaltecas, zapotecas, chichimecas and a very big etc** but for the Spanish Conquistadors all were the fucking so they treated almost the same. Making as big (and stupid) mistakes of sending Christianized Indians to other tribes so as they were all Indians would help Christianize the others… big mistake… some of these tribes actually hate each other with passion and just killed the now catholic newcomers. Almost all hated the Aztecs though as they were the most powerful ferocious and asked for big taxes just because they could. Ironic enough New Spain would be formally and informally baptized as México so I can just imagine cringe their face in horror at the news XD
*Sons and daughters of a Spanish or “criollo” and a indigen person were classified as “Mestizos” this ones had less privileges than ”Criollos” and were subdivided according how many Spanish and Indian grandfathers had. A “mestizo” with 3 spanish grandparents and one indigen was called a “Castizo” and was a the top of the scale. If your Spanish family was very rich, and loved you very much or just didn’t want anyone to know one of they like to screw indigen persons bribery’s and negotiations could be done and the “Mestizo” member of the family would be considered “Criollo” This of course meant that a significant quantity of money would be given to the king, and to the church so they change the baptismal accounts.
*Slaves were imported from Africa and they definitely had the short end of the stick as the indigens and mestizos were at least… “free” and protected by the crown. A African person was taken to the new Spain to be abused… many of those men ended having children with “mestizas” or “indias” probably so their offspring with enough time would be able to “cheat” the social system and pass as indigens or “mestizos” Those children were considered “Mulatos” “Zambos” “Sacalaguas” among other names. This process seemed to continue after independence even if slavery was eliminated and is probably the reason a “black community” doesn’t exist over here is that most it was assimilated into the rest of the population. Some

The entire fucking race or social issues derive from them even if slavery was eliminated right after independence social differences were made not exactly by race but by socio-economical condition. Rich Criollos automatically thought they were better as everybody else and tried to be the ruling group, as they were proud of being of Spanish blood they only married within themselves, or with rich people from Spain… if they had nobility titles even better* After they decided to marry foreigners… rich ones of course and new rich. To this day there are families that pride into their purity of white blood having money or not…
Indigens or Indians tribes were mostly ignored or abused by rich landowners so they decided to isolate themselves to protect themselves, sometimes are described as “Fatalist” as some of this tribe way of thinking is like this “We were here before them, and will be here when they all would be gone” (referring to everybody else)
Mestizos ended becoming the majority of the population, government tried to make a unified country by making all people think as  themselves as “Mexicans” and not as mestizos/criollos/indigens/mullatos/whatever. This method worked at mostly except for some Criollo families who liked to think of themselves as Europeans or some indigen tribes that as they don’t see why they should do that as this country hasn’t done anything for them.
Of course this philosophy to work needed the incursion of  “The other” as the enemy, “The other” being the spanishmen****, or the North-Americans*****, “The conservatorism”****** or whatever people that were conveniently available.

Also… I almost forgot… depending of the place you go you can find places that don’t like “prietos” (dark skin), places that don’t like black people+  and l People who hate Asians++.

So at the end we have this big chain of everybody hating everybody else, the poor hating the rich, the rich despising the poor, people that would never date “prietos”,anarcho-nationalists, mochos (catholic retards), etc and etc… Oh such a beautiful country we are

*I'm no fucking kiding that is our oficial name.... curse you founders for your lack of originality!!! :gonk
**Sorry too much different groups here… would take me all night to count them all
***Even when government decided to eliminate all the nobility titles over here this people demanded to still be refered as count/baron/marquis/etc
****Which has no sense now as the current population in spain is guilty of what they ancestors or fellow spanishmen ancestors did.
***** Sorry about that … is just that you are the most powerful country near and your government also has many blame for that…
******They wanted to make an absolute monarchy here ruled by an European prince… and failed miserably so obviously everything wrong in the country would be their fault XD
+ Not at the point of HATE, HATE, KILL, KILL but they just won’t be able not to notice that person…
++ mostly Chinese, more a psychological hate as Chinese men were used to give the corporal punishment into big ranch and also Indian couples were separated and the wife given to the Chinese men as a wife…

Illegal immigrants when detected, and deported, I have some busses going to the north of the republic(most specific to the USA) are raided by military and people at asked for their id… if they don’t have it with them they are asked to sing the Mexican Anthem and if they are unable to they are deported to Guatemala or Belize… the funny thing is that many Mexicans are deported by accident by that method as they just don’t know how the fucking song goes… which torns me into the decision of laughing of crying

Alithea wrote:

I do know that some friends of mine went to Paris for vacation and were treated much better when they spoke Spanish and not English.

That is actually a truth... personally I tried French first... when they saw my French was so sucky then started to talk to me on English and even Spanish but me trying at least to speak in French made them more accesible.

Alithea wrote:

I do know that some friends of mine went to Paris for vacation and were treated much better when they spoke Spanish and not English.

That is actually a truth... personally I tried French first... when they saw my French was so sucky then started to talk to me on English and even Spanish but me trying at least to speak in French made them more accesible.

Last edited by Romanticide (04-24-2007 09:55:10 PM)

Racism in Canada is a difficult subject to address.  There is a serious dichotomy in how people view racism and in how it is defined.  There are several examples from my own life that I will use to illustrate this. 

1.  I am part native, but it is a very, very small part.  I attempted to gain my status card when I learned this, and tried to verify among my own relatives/ancestors, just how native are we.  In my case, it is not much.  My great grandfather was half Cree.  My great grandmother was a blinding racist, but never seemed to mind that her husband was part native.  I found out that she was racist over several minute occurences that I won't go into to deep of detail over.  The worst part of Meme's racism is that is was so casual, and so easy for her.  She had no trouble equating people to the most ridiculous of stereotypes based solely on last names or skin colour.  It wasn't just natives, or blacks, or asians, it was also polish, ukrainians, and to a lesser extent anybody that wasn't french and catholic.  Even other catholics got the short end from her.  In retrospect, what was even worse was that my great grandfather never embraced his heritage, or even really acknowledged it.  He grew up in a time when you had to live on a reservation to hold your status card, which basically meant you were taken care of, but had no room  to grow and no chance to live on your own terms.  He buried his "shame" in a french name and what I would consider to be willful blindness.  The result of these actions is a deep seeded guilt and shame complex in the few people in my family that know about Pepe's real heritage, because we cannot share it with the family as a whole, even two decades after Pepe's death, and a decade after Meme's death.  This resulted in several embarrassing days and the Bureau of Indian affairs here in Edmonton, while I was trying to determine whether or not I had any right to the treaty cheques, tax breaks and free college education that treaty status would entitle me to. 

2.  I grew up in a whitebread small town on the plains, in a fairly redneck part of the country.  There were no asians, one black kid and a bare handful of middle eastern families that I knew of.  I also went to a catholic school, which was predominatley populated by other white catholic children.  Race relations were so much a non-issue (due to lack of exposure) that I literally thought for quite a while that I would never ever meet an asian woman because I didn't think they left China, or Japan, or whatever country the men came from.  Even the Chinese restuarant in town had a mostly white staff, managed grumpily by a very tired chinese man, whose name coincidentally, was Man.  The whole point of this little aside is that every time anybody who wasn't white came to our school, or I ran into uptown got all kinds of ridiculous attention.  It wasn't to bad for me, because my mom had managed to impress upon me that we are all equals, no matter what anyone says.  My classmates were another story.  The black boy that came to our school for one year was so much the centre of attention, all the time, that his parents actually pulled him out of school and put him into the public school system.  The same thing happened with the first "brown" kid that came to our school.  I use the term "brown" because I never actually found out where he was from.  He had no accent, had grown up in Canada all of his life, but when he came to Leduc from Toronto, his life became a goldfish bowl.  He never had any real privacy at school.  Everyone was up in his grill, so to speak, from the start of the day till hometime.  He also left to go to the public school system, but he lasted two full years.  I don't think anybody I went to school with would really think negatively of the way these two people were treated, but nobody else ever got that kind of attention, ever.  (repetition for emphasis)

3.  When I finally managed to go to a "real" school, I was in college.  I was attending night classes at a community college in Edmonton.  The vast majority of students in my classes were women and non-white immigrants.  I had never been so deeply exposed to that many different skin colours, cultures, languages and attitudes in my entire life.  After a couple of days of culture shock, not just from the other students, but also because I was a freshman, I adapted and really began to enjoy it.  I was amazed at how easily we all got along, until this one night, somebody actually used the word nigger towards one of my friends.  My friend, whose name is Oriel, was big, black as night, and beautiful.  The fool who called him a nigger was a skinny white, eminem wannabe that was at first trying to be friends with Oriel, but then trying to get some kind of reaction out of him after Oriel had politely told the kid to get lost.  It is hard to put into text how Oriel took it.  He simply got larger, not physically of course, but spiritually, somehow.  His presence seemed to fill the entire room, all at once, and it was if everything stopped and held its breath.  Very calmly, and with almost inhuman patience, Oriel asked this kid "What was it you just called me?"   The kid seemed to wilt, and just said "forget about it" (if i could make the text small i would, because it was barely a whisper)  Oriel let it drop, but I was stunned that somebody could be so crass and ignorant. 

The whole point of this ramble is that Racism in Canada is a definite reality, but usually we (as a whole) seem to be a little more tolerant of each other up here.  At least in my experience. 

I have heard all kinds of other things, from other people, and from other places here in Canada.  There is racial violence, and there are issues that need to be dealt with.   Most of the gangs in Edmonton are racially based, native gangs, and Asian gangs.  There are constant jokes about the Lebanese Mafia.  I think it is a shame that people can still be so dumb about this, but I have the advantage of living in a place that hasn't had the strife that some places have had, especially in the last 50 years. 

I hope you found this informative, although I think I may have more to say later.

I love double standards! When my high school formed a Umajo club (or however it was spelled) I started a campaign to have a Caucasian Historical Society, to get together and discusss, like, European history. My grounds were that we had a Japanese Club, an Asian Society, the latino club, whose name I forgot (and, despite my being Italian, didn't consider me latin), and now Umajo, which is African. I got shot down because of "how it would seem", but still, it was fun to try.

I also ran press on our schools Gay/Straight Alliance despite the principal telling me it was pretty much forbidden. We were allowed to write the article, but couldn't state the name of the club, or it's charter or anything. Yeah, what's the point in the article? So I gave him the censored one, and he approved it, and I published my original. That little stunt helped ban me from newspaper for the rest of my high school career. But, really, I was okay with that.

I have to admit I haven't read everything everyone said above.  There is a lot of text up there, but I have read what my fellow Canadians wrote.  It is interesting to see what is happening to other parts of the country.  I live in Toronto, probably a city with most people from different ethic groups.  I say in general, we are doing pretty good.  I don't know how other people feel, but when I go out and see people in different skin colours, speaking different languages, and dressing up in different clothings that fits their cultures, it just seems a natural thing.  White people is just one of the many type of people here, surely not a majority.  Most people are quite open-minded and we pretty much live in harmony.  However, racism do exist overhere occasionally.  I'm Chinese myself, and I work in a retail pharmacy.  None of my whole pharmacy team is white (except the boss), and once a couple of years we would see some rednecks making some unfriendly racial comments.  The most ironical one actually came from not a white woman, but a black woman.  Most of the time we won't make a big deal out of it because, unfortunately, we are in customer service.  However, if I am on shift and see customers go way out of board and giving us crap, I would certainly give them hell, because racism towards myself and my staff is one thing I would definitely not tolerate.  I personally do not use the word "immigrants" on this issue, because I firmly believe that unless you are a native, we are all immigrants.  I think all white people here in Canada should realize they don't have more of a right then other people and they are not more "homey" here in Canada than others just because their ancestors immigrated to Canada a couple of hundred years earlier than the ancestors of people from other ethic groups do.  And I also like to point out, if you look into the history of North America, people now realize that Christopher Columbus wasn't the first outside people set foot on the "new continent".  They have reasons to believe that Chinese were probably here in North America before Columbus was.

All in all, I personally think Canada is probably the most multi-cultural country in the the world with the most tolerant people and the least racism.

And another thing I'd like to mention is, most chinese (and maybe people from other countries too) when we come to Canada, have learned to be aggressive or assertive and being up-front to speak for ourselves.  We Chinese are usually quite reserved, forgiving, easy-going, and don't want to make a small problem big.  However, a lot of us realize when we are here in Canada, we have to be more aggressive, defensive, and speak out loud for ourselves, otherwise other people will ignore us, push us around, or simply not take our concern seriously.  It's a common saying that we come to Canada and we first learn to complain.  I don't know if it is just a different in social norm, or if it has anything to do with racism, but some times it seems like if you want to be treated fairly, you need to be aggressive (or at least assertive).  I certainly don't think it is a good social norm

Last edited by Rushita (04-26-2007 09:11:58 AM)

Personal, i think everyone is a little bit racist: it's in our blood, we judge people for what we know of them and if what we know of them is only their look or they race, we just walk with precaution according of our suspects, but that's natural, it's human and in my point of view it's understandable. What is *not* correct is not to give them the right of the doubt; everyone is different and we all know that, too.

When somebody says "don't threat him different if he's chinese" they are lying to theirselfs, it's obvious they will threat him different, as he would threat us different that to their own kind! But trying to know him makes the difference between racism and natural.

I difference 4 grades of racism:

Pretending to be color blind   -   Natural racism   -   Passive racist   -   Son of a bitch

Color blind people: there isn't such thing as color blindness in my opinion. If we all could just admit that we are all racist a little bit, maybe we could work better together and accept us of how different we are. I don't like this people at all, but i don't mess with them - usually. Perhaps, someone can be color blind, but i think only a 20% of all the people who swears to be color blind, they really aren't.

Natural racism: they are just racist at the beginning, as i said before, in a natural and understandable way, they prejudge but they don't swear, after prejudging they investigate, meet and after, the judge.

Passive racist: They don't like foreigners, they prejudge and they don't want to know this people. Maybe they talk bad about them, but they don't really mess with them. They just go on their way.

Son of a bitch: I don't need to explain this, do i?

Romanticide wrote:

Large post with pop tarts involving Spanish Colonization

Oh dear, i think i love having a mexican fellow in this forums.


Spain is a really racist country, but it has an amazing internal war between right side and left side. The 50% of the people are huge racist people (specially old people, who lived the Franco's era) and the other 50% are real hippies.

The rest, the people of my age (13-25) doesn't really have an opinion. In school, everything about the conquest of Mexico has been forgotten. There's anything left in books, the teachers only teach you who was Cristobal Colón. Everything that happened after you will learn it just if you study History Carreer. I find it kind of sad.

I feel somehow upset, and hypocrite, but spanish aren't the guilty ones here, is the government, the education, but if you learn about spanish history you can understand a little bit more of why this happened:

Franco was a huge ass sucker > people who was born in this era were horrible raised in stupid conditions and under stupid laws in schools > Franco's dead > this people are now adults, they raise their kids as they know > when the 3rd generation was born (kind of, my mother generation), their parents spoiled them because they didn't want that they lived what they lived in their horrible childhood when Spain was poor.

Result: stupid spoiled brats and teenagers, inculture, total lack of diplomacy in the mass media, education, hospitals and disorganization.

Add to all this the continuous internal war between hippies and fascist people. We can't suppose that in this conditions the spanish can learn world history, when they can't even control the teenagers in schools, there are a lot of cases of students hitting their teachers, and even threats of death.

*back to topic*

Spanish are racist: new generations, no. They are not racist (WITH LATIN AMERICANS ONLY, there are tons of different races living in Spain such as muslims (in the south), africans, chinese, russians....)), they are ignorant.



También tengo que añadir, querida Tania, que por desgracia nuestro pais no es racista, sino MUY clacisista.

Okay, enough.

ShatteredMirror wrote:

Cristobal Colón is probably not my favorite mass murderer.

He's not a mass murderer, he didn't even know that he actually discovered a new land. He died thinking he reached India.

Last edited by Epi_lepsia (04-28-2007 06:07:12 AM)

ShatteredMirror wrote:

Cristobal Colón is probably not my favorite mass murderer.

So who is your favourite mass murderer then?

Romanticide wrote:

he wouldn't be the last... all spanish expeditions that came demanded gold to the inhabitants... probably even more than food... andyou want a fucking sadist bastart? Search Nuño Beltrán de Guzman... he burned people alive just because he could...

I just did...I think the most depressing part about this is that I didn't find his story particularly unusual...It's hard to remember that mad dogs like this were extreme cases that have been remarked on by history because they were extreme cases.  Especially when it seems there were so many...We must also remember that each of us has that capacity for hatred and violence within us, and we must make a conscious decision to respect our fellows.  I have no desire to be anything like Guzman, so I choose not to be.  I choose instead to be an advocate of peace and friendship among the peoples of the world.  I do not expect to succeed, or to witness the end of violence and hatred.  I have no great confidence that progress will be made in my lifetime.  But I won't give up.

Romanticide wrote:

Epi_lepsia wrote:

The rest, the people of my age (13-25) doesn't really have an opinion. In school, everything about the conquest of Mexico has been forgotten. There's anything left in books, the teachers only teach you who was Cristobal Colón. Everything that happened after you will learn it just if you study History Carreer. I find it kind of sad.

What? Godfucking dammit this continent resources maintained that country for centuries and Mexican gold served to pay the election of Carlos V as a emperor... geez... what the hell... (oh well Mexican oficial history is not that diferent... we tend to forget that one of our biggest independence heroes was spanish-born,Francisco Javier Mina... (and I have to admit the guy in some pictures looks really handsome... ... I like Vicente Guerrero too , Morelos and Hidalgo no thanks.. one is too old and both were priest... ) and that Maximiliano de Hasburgo wasn't really a bad guy... he did more for the indian population that the so called "liberals" (Everytime you watch Sisi remember... her brother in law was killed here XD)

Damn..... Vicente Guerrero... dude, you're raping my childhood that was disgusting! eeeww!! xD

Well, spanish people hardly know who Hernan Cortez was, not even talking about Hildalgo or Jose Maria Morelos.... you know, talking about handsomeness, i think el pípila is a good option, you know, with fire and stuff...

Epi_lepsia wrote:

También tengo que añadir, querida Tania, que por desgracia nuestro pais no es racista, sino MUY clacisista.

And "Malinchista" (Malichismo is when you hate the people in your own country and adore foreigners just because they are foreigners... an example is the people who dream that an american or an european(a rich one) will marry them and take them out of Mexico to never return...)

Well i don't agree with that, mexicans are proud of being mexicans (a very good example is the love to our flag and the independence day). You would know what real malinquismo is if you lived in Spain longer than a week. Last month, they put a spanish flag infront of my school. Is no longer there 8D people were pissed of, they hate their name, they don't call theirselfs "spanish" (se llaman andaluces, catalanes, etc...) and they hate their flag and hymn.

Romanticide wrote:

Epi_lepsia wrote:

Damn..... Vicente Guerrero... dude, you're raping my childhood that was disgusting! eeeww!! xD

My job is done heeeeereeeee!!!

Well, spanish people hardly know who Hernan Cortez was, not even talking about Hildalgo or Jose Maria Morelos....

What the hell do they teach to people in these schools!!!

They teach us El Quijote de memoria!

you know, talking about handsomeness, i think el pípila is a good option, you know, with fire and stuff...

He didn't use a rock as a shield for the bullets... he use a flaming poptart!!! Also he didn't torch the door of the Alhondiga with a torch... he used a flaming poptart!!1 All to get the secret stash of poptarts inside!!!! (as poptarts were valuable things in the independence war!!!! )

YEAH!! El pípila's real name was Nemuro!!! yeeeeeey

Epi_lepsia wrote:

Well i don't agree with that, mexicans are proud of being mexicans (a very good example is the love to our flag and the independence day). You would know what real malinquismo is if you lived in Spain longer than a week. Last month, they put a spanish flag infront of my school. Is no longer there 8D people were pissed of, they hate their name, they don't call theirselfs "spanish" (se llaman andaluces, catalanes, etc...) and they hate their flag and hymn.

Malinchism and racism in Mexico depends the place you go, in the schools I were girls that dreamed to marry blond foreigners and be taken away from this country. The racist happens especially in small town were they just don't like chinese or black people... with no particular reason either, my grandmother didn't and I know many people that thought the same. 

And in the Spain case... is more isolationism, they think spanish as foreigners and think as their region as their country (cataluña, andalucia etc)  But hey is not that weird... think about "the sister republic of Yucatan" who wanted to independence itself many time but couldn't, Chiapas also tried, and Texas definately succeed only to ask to the U.S.A. to accept them as a state... XD

They tried to independence but for different reasons: let's admit it, mexico está de la chingada, the money and the living conditions make people thinking about many options to get better; even if that implies separating of your country.

But here is kind of different, when you ask somebody "Are you spanish" the answer will be "No, i'm catalan / andaluz / vasco / gallego ". If you have a spanish flag, it's like an insult. They throw eggs to the national flag in madrid daily.

And, about the malinquismo, if poor people (as you said, in small towns) raise their girls in that way, they will desire to get married with a rich foreigner for not being poor anymore.

I think, "racism" in Mexico depends a lot of the economy situation of each one.