This is a static copy of In the Rose Garden, which existed as the center of the western Utena fandom for years. Enjoy. :)
After watching Sofia Coppola’s Marie Antoinette for the billionth time this past weakened, it really hit me why I have not made mention on the forums here of the similarity between this movie and Utena. Aside from both stories have the strong “Revolution” overtones, and the elaborate settings. Both are very similar. I swear Sofia is familiar with Ikuhara’s world.
One of the main points of Marie Antoinette that really hit a connection for me was a panoramic view of Versailles, while a mob of people are shouting about the Queen, and one then yells out “Did you hear what she said?!”. It cuts to Marie in a tub: be-decked in diamonds with dark makeup on, and she says the famous line, “Let them eat cake.”
The scene was very reminiscent of Anthy sending Dios to the castle and the mob screaming what she did to her brother.
Of course there are many other sprinklings, but with most movies they are better seen than read.
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I recently got the movie ( Marie) and am itching to see it, so I'll try to keep an eye out for Utena overtones. Sounds interesting.
Sevelle wrote:
she says the famous line, “Let them eat cake.”
Hurts so bad. That's just an urban legend.
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They mention that in the movie, and how some slander against her is really awful.
Last edited by Sevelle (05-08-2007 11:30:37 AM)
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iruka wrote:
Sevelle wrote:
she says the famous line, “Let them eat cake.”
Hurts so bad. That's just an urban legend.
Well, that urban legend started while she was still in power, if I remember correctly, so it may be in the movie in that context.
EDIT: Ah, sorry, Sevelle already said that much.
Last edited by Lightice (05-08-2007 11:43:47 AM)
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The story I'd always been told about Marie's "Let them eat cake" remark was that she had been told that the poor were angry because they had no bread to eat. In her naivete, she allegedly replied, "Then, let them eat cake."
And I'd honestly been thinking about parallels between SKU and that period of French history. Of course, the similarity to Rose of Versailles kind of helps.
And I wouldn't really be surprised if Sofia Coppola had watched either Rose of Versailles or SKU, or possibly both. She did make Lost in Translation, which is set in Japan, after all.
Last edited by Raven Nightshade (05-08-2007 04:20:05 PM)
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I was always informed that she never said the line (If she was mentioned at all), just the rantings of citizens looking for a scapegoat.
Raven Nightshade wrote:
And I'd honestly been thinking about parallels between SKU and that period of French history. Of course, the similarity to Rose of Versailles kind of helps.
And I wouldn't really be surprised if Sofia Coppola had watched either Rose of Versailles or SKU, or possibly both. She did make Lost in Translation, which is set in Japan, after all.
Utena does have strong French overtones! I mean, Ohtori resembling Versailles. The Student Council’s dress does look awfully French militaristic. And then there’s Revolution.
PS: Oh one might even notice the final facial expression of Marie. Let me find a picture, but it looks extremely similar to Anthy and Utena’s expression in the finale.
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Well I've read in a couple of places that Saito was a fan of Rose of Versailles. Also some of her other stuff is based in Europe. One's based in Italy about a girl fighting being stuck in a rosebride-ish position due to a painting...
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Ohh I want to read that Italian one.
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There was an article about Saito and her material waaaay back when SKU the manga was being published in Animerica. I'll look it up and get you the title to look for.
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I shall Google it!
*Hazaa*
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Didja find, didja didja???
I've been watching Brother, Dear Brother, which is the same creator as RoV, and I can see a lot of similarities there as well. One of the characters is quite clearly the inspiration for Juri's character design. RoV probably influenced it more, although I recall Ikuhara saying it hadn't. I always take him for a miserable liar.
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Ah-HEM I think you'll find Miss Saito (if she's still a Miss that is...) might have been a bigger influence in developement than Iku lets on. Besides I heard BePapas started up because they had all read a lot of the same books if I remember right.
Depending on where this is chronologically I think I found a proto Utena. Leonora in Kakan no Madonna (The Flower Crown Madonna), she disguises herself as a boy and everything. Replace the Emerald Lion sword with the Sword of Dios and things pretty much go from there.
Look I even have a pretty picture:
From Animerica Extra Vol. 6 #3 (also pictured is Daughter of the Nile)
Edit: Oh and judging by the article in Vol.5 #6 practically half of her early works are set in Paris.
Last edited by Mai_Kanzaki (05-10-2007 08:39:09 AM)
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Mai_Kanzaki wrote:
Edit: Oh and judging by the article in Vol.5 #6 practically half of her early works are set in Paris.
And from what I recall of my digging around at her stuff, she has rather a certain fondness for Indian characters.
The Paris thing might be a disease of the genre though, Saito, honestly, has done a lot of cookie-cutter romance mangas that are the manga version of bodice-ripper romance novels.
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I wonder if Utena would be Utena with out Ikuhara?
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Probably have a few less WTF!?!-isms and we would've had Akio with wings at the end.
I for one would like to see if Dios vs Akio would turn out like the Razara's fight films between Akio and the thing from the movie.
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Speaking of WTF moment's, what was up wtih Nanami and the egg?! I never understood that episode.
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I read somewhere on here that it was a metaphor for growing up and getting one's first period and that Nanami didn't understand what was going on. Something like that.
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Well I knid of got that, however . . . it was just strange.
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Sevelle wrote:
Well I knid of got that, however . . . it was just strange.
Here's what I think. I think schools should show that episode to girls if they ever want to teach them something memorable about periods and teen pregnancy for sex-ed classes instead of those old videos from the library every year.
Nobody ever paid attention from what I remembered.
Last edited by Hiraku (05-12-2007 10:26:23 PM)
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You know most of the class would be like:
"What the fucking hell was that!?"
And proceed to go into madness.
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