This is a static copy of In the Rose Garden, which existed as the center of the western Utena fandom for years. Enjoy. :)

#51 | Back to Top07-23-2007 12:32:21 PM

Dematrah
Ruthless Deflorist
From: Kansas City
Registered: 10-16-2006
Posts: 300

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

I got my best friend to watch Utena the other day. We both stayed up until 5 a.m. trying to squeeze in as much as possible. The farther we got into the series, the more excited she was to get to the next episode, and when we finished an episode she'd exclaim "FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, PLAY THE NEXT ONE!!!"

Ten episodes from the end, she wanted to watch the movie (she had to leave in a couple hours, and I had already sent my DVD collection with her (we were watching it on my computer))...needless to say, her opinion of it was very "....W...T...FFFFFFFFFF" and she was in fits of laughter by the end.

She finished the series last night, and had this to say:

Shel says:
dfhgskdlfjg

Shel says:
At least they didn't turn into CARS

Shel says:
Athough, Anthy stabbing Utena was -very- W. T. F.

Shel says:
THEN IT WAS ALL TAKE HER GODDAMN HAND ALREADY YOU FREAK!

Ah, good times. etc-love


"We want beans, not goals." - Anon.

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#52 | Back to Top07-23-2007 12:48:15 PM

dollface
Postmistress Elf of Subtext
From: North Carolina
Registered: 11-17-2006
Posts: 5086
Website

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

Frau Eva wrote:

Although this all brings up something I've randomly been feeling lately...I've honestly just been getting the impression that no one can say anything bad about Shiori here without getting a lecture about motivations. I understand her motivations, I sympathize with her teenage angst, but can I just say that she acts like a crazy bitch sometimes? I know it's mostly because she's been maligned for so long by many fans, but...it seems like the board is overall pretty accepting of all the characters. It seems like a similar thing with Juri fans back in the day, who could never admit that it's pretty much her own fault she's still moping around like an emotard. But this could just be an impression, and I'm just gauging things.

We had this conversation with Yasha. emot-frown Razara and I have been putting in effort to calm ourselves. Are they not enough? I promise, I've been trying. It's just hard to break old habits.

For the record, I don't think Shiori is perfect. I think she's a neurotic, selfish bitch. But I'm a fan. I've taken time to understand her good as well as her bad. My friend has not. I'm sorry if you think I'm stuck-up, but I don't think people who dislike Shiori should be able to say negative things about her and not expect someone would try to explain things. If Razara or Blade said Shiori was a bitch, I wouldn't think anything of it, because I know they understand her and don't mean the comment to be negative. My friend has never sat back and thought about any of this. She doesn't know half the characters names. Do you think she has a right to tell me that my favorite character is a bitch? Perhaps, in human rights terms, she does. But in fan terms, I don't think so. It's just all a matter of respect, in my eyes. She knows how much Shiori means to me, yet she still bashes her. Do you think she should be able to do that, and I should just say 'Well, your opinion is valuable and accurate'? If you've seen SKU, if you've analyzed the series, or even moreso, Shiori in particular, your opinion is your own and I would certainly be wrong to try and change it. But if you've only ever seen Shiori in episode 17, and the glimpse of her in 7, you blame me for trying to expain her motives? I just think that if she doesn't respect the series enough to understand all of the characters, that's fine. But, as my friend, you should respect me enough to keep your hateful thoughts to yourself.


ah, man does not exist; ah, within the darkness; ah, the sound of the waves

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#53 | Back to Top07-23-2007 01:20:12 PM

Razara
Marionette Mistress
From: Wuzzy Happy Akio Town (What?)
Registered: 10-17-2006
Posts: 4694

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

Frau Eva wrote:

Although this all brings up something I've randomly been feeling lately...I've honestly just been getting the impression that no one can say anything bad about Shiori here without getting a lecture about motivations. I understand her motivations, I sympathize with her teenage angst, but can I just say that she acts like a crazy bitch sometimes? I know it's mostly because she's been maligned for so long by many fans, but...it seems like the board is overall pretty accepting of all the characters. It seems like a similar thing with Juri fans back in the day, who could never admit that it's pretty much her own fault she's still moping around like an emotard. But this could just be an impression, and I'm just gauging things.

Like dollface said, we've already had this conversation, and so I'd rather we not start another one.

I'm overly defensive of Shiori, and that's just how I am. It always bothered me when people automatically condemn Shiori as an evil demon from hell, and not being able to stand up for my opinion, which I was unable to do for a really long time, always killed me inside. I don't really expect any of you to understand this, and I probably seem stupid for caring so much. But I haven't said much in Shiori's defense as of lately, so I think that you'll all agree that I'm improving on this matter.

Either way, I'm sorry for standing up for my beliefs. Honestly, I'm just glad that I'm standing up for what I believe in at all, even if I'm being rather obnoxious while doing so.

In the case of dollface's friend, it's just rude that she continues to insult Shiori, even though she knows that it upsets her. When you do or say something that you know is going to upset a lot of people, or even one person, obviously they're going to get defensive of their opinion. It's human nature, but some people enjoy provoking this nature. We all like to believe that we're right, even when the correct answer and the wrong answer aren't very far apart.

Like in Frau Eva's story, I showed my ex-boyfriend D.N.Angel a few years ago, which, at the time, was my favorite anime. He complained about everything that happened, said that everyone was gay, and laughed when my favorite character was trying to kill himself. He knew that this offended me, but he continued to make these comments anyway.

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#54 | Back to Top07-23-2007 01:32:22 PM

Wolfio
Miki Molester
Registered: 06-13-2007
Posts: 36

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

Deliberately insulting a character to get on someone's nerves or not listening to the "whole" story is different that insulting a character because you're being honest. If a friend *knows* it bothers you to an extreme, they should stop, or at least attempt to see past a characters "loudest" traits. If the viewer doesn't understand that, they might not understand the point of watching the series... I just got a friend to start watching the series (had to skim the first arc though, because she wasn't into it. She's loving the second one) and I'd like her to be honest with her opinions. If she feels this or that way about someone, then that's her thoughts and it helps me see different sides of the series.

There is also that third type of insult, which I use quite often. I'll insult characters using their worst traits in a joking way, though I don't think this is what is going on here.

My "I don't think she'll like this" friend does not like Utena. I'm going to show her the second arc and see what she thinks.

My other friend was "eh" with it until the second arc hit. Hopefully she'll continue to enjoy it. emot-smile

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#55 | Back to Top07-23-2007 03:44:52 PM

Frau Eva
Voodoo Queen
Registered: 10-16-2006
Posts: 803

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

If it's been gone over before, then my mistake. I was just under the impression that Yasha's talk was over derailing threads, and not general defensiveness. But its been a while since I've looked at it, so eh. emot-biggrin

Anyway, I just try to look at both sides sometimes, so I presented each situation as I wasn't sure which would fit best. But yeah, it seems from your description that she's doing the first situation and just being obnoxious. Again, don't feel too bad about it being over an anime character. There's a point when someone is being negative for no reason other than to make you uncomfortable. This can happen with music, movies, anything. Once she's voiced her opinion once, there's no reason for her to keep repeating it. I had a friend once who took a perverse delight in bashing Amelia from Slayers in front of me because I liked her. And even though I liked the character in a more passive way and wasn't even touchy about her, it just gets...old and obnoxious. And another person who bashed Relena constantly, and even though I have only a luke-warm-like of Relena, it still got obnoxious. There's really no point in ANYONE devoting so much hate to a fictional character. And someone isn't your friend if they can't eventually decide to agree to disagree.

At this point, its not even about Utena anymore, its about her respecting your opinion and you two's friendship. You may want to tell her something like, "Hey, I know you don't like Shiori, and that's fine, but could you stop saying it so much? I get the picture, and its kind of getting on my nerves. I wouldn't insult a character you liked all the time, would I? All I ask is that you keep an open mind, since the series isn't nearly over yet. And if you still don't like her after seeing everything, then we'll have to agree to disagree."

Last edited by Frau Eva (07-23-2007 03:45:13 PM)


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#56 | Back to Top07-24-2007 12:09:26 AM

bella
Atlantean Singer
Registered: 11-04-2006
Posts: 581

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

One of my friends actually wanted to watch Utena because I talk about it all the time and she wanted to know what the hell I was talking about when I went into my crazy rants. I don't know how she's taking it. She seems to hate Touga and Anthy and Saionji. She'll probably fall in love with Akio.


Happy Holidays Everyone! :3

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#57 | Back to Top07-24-2007 12:35:41 AM

Hiraku
Easter Elf #40
From: Singapore
Registered: 02-21-2007
Posts: 6342
Website

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

bella wrote:

One of my friends actually wanted to watch Utena because I talk about it all the time and she wanted to know what the hell I was talking about when I went into my crazy rants. I don't know how she's taking it. She seems to hate Touga and Anthy and Saionji. She'll probably fall in love with Akio.

She hates Anthy already? emot-aaa
Your friend might be on to something here. How did she feel about Kozue and Shiori and Nanami?

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#58 | Back to Top07-24-2007 01:48:05 AM

Tamago
God of Comedy
From: Minami Goushuu
Registered: 10-17-2006
Posts: 14280
Website

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

Assuming you were able to convince someone to watch Utena without resorting to this:
http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o50/spatulasama/clockwork_orange.jpg

I would recommend that its best to watch Utena in a dark room with both their mind and their pants open. emot-keke

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#59 | Back to Top07-24-2007 02:50:05 AM

ShatteredMirror
Yaoi Pet #1
From: Sacramento, CA
Registered: 10-22-2006
Posts: 8858

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

Razara wrote:

I'm overly defensive of Shiori, and that's just how I am. It always bothered me when people automatically condemn Shiori as an evil demon from hell, and not being able to stand up for my opinion, which I was unable to do for a really long time, always killed me inside. I don't really expect any of you to understand this, and I probably seem stupid for caring so much. But I haven't said much in Shiori's defense as of lately, so I think that you'll all agree that I'm improving on this matter.

Either way, I'm sorry for standing up for my beliefs. Honestly, I'm just glad that I'm standing up for what I believe in at all, even if I'm being rather obnoxious while doing so.

Don't apologize for standing up for your beliefs. Apologize for being obnoxious, if you do it. Apologize for pissing people off, if you do it. But standing up for what you believe in is not in and of itself something that should ever be apologized for.

I remember towards the end of a stormy friendship I got into a huge fight with the friend in question because during a conversation about books Catcher in the Rye came up and I spoke briefly (this was through IM, I think it was about six sentences) about why I couldn't stand Holden (who with the exception of Willy Loman from Death of a Salesman is probably my all-time least favorite literary character). This was when I found out that he was one of her all-time favorite literary characters and she liked him not despite but because of all of his glaring shortcomings and identified with him so strongly that when I criticized him she felt like I was criticizing her. She then attempted to explain his motivations to me and tell me why I shouldn't dislike him. Throughout the conversation I kept telling her that she had every right to like him but I didn't, and didn't feel that his situation excused his behavior. She ended up completely flying off the handle and we didn't speak to each other for quite a while.

Sound familiar? Now, it's not exactly the same as dollface's situation with her friend, as at the time I had read the entire book and didn't go on at lengths about how much I hated him (though I do inasmuch as I can hate anyone who isn't real). And from the sound of things I was a lot more polite about not liking him. But just keep in mind that even after seeing the whole series, even after seeing the motivations, she may never like Shiori. But the important issue here isn't so much her like or dislike of Shiori but the fact that she is being very unkind by going on about it at far greater lengths than is necessary.


Pride is not the opposite of shame, but its source.

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#60 | Back to Top07-24-2007 11:20:00 PM

brian
Atlantean Singer
Registered: 10-22-2006
Posts: 589

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

I'm a bit reluctant to get into this emotional thread but may I suggest that the two mangas and the movie might be a better way to start.

For people who might be easily shocked or like lush art or have a very romantic disposition than the first manga might be best.

The movie manga is the easist to understand and maybe the best for impatient people.

The movie is a good way to get artsy people hooked on the ambitious mystery of the story.  "Now you need to watch the anime so all the weird things in the movie will become clear."  emot-rolleyes school-devil

For some people the best seduction might be a well-written review.

Last edited by brian (07-24-2007 11:22:11 PM)

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#61 | Back to Top07-25-2007 08:26:41 AM

Razara
Marionette Mistress
From: Wuzzy Happy Akio Town (What?)
Registered: 10-17-2006
Posts: 4694

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

I know that you're all trying to help, but I'm getting so sick of being the cause of thread derailment that it's making me not want to talk about Shiori at all. I rarely speak around most people in real life because I find that whenever I say something, it's always something stupid, so I find it better not to talk at all. I'm frequently finding that I feel the same way whenever I post on the forum, and not just about Shiori either.

Now talk about getting people to watch SKU, damnit. emot-mad

I'm still trying to get my best friend to watch it. He's always reluctant to watch things. When we first tried to show him D.N.Angel, he didn't want to watch it, but he ended up loving it. I've showed him up to the ending of the Black Rose Saga, and he says he doesn't hate it, which I think is his way of saying he likes it.

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#62 | Back to Top07-25-2007 11:47:05 AM

Arki
Dark Whisperer
From: Croatia
Registered: 10-28-2006
Posts: 1123

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

If I'm allowed to post the shameless nonsense that plagues my posts, so should you be allowed to post the insightful comment. You know, to balance it out. (: No reason to assume by default that what you say is stupid. People here are honest, they would have told you by now. school-devil

Razara wrote:

Now talk about getting people to watch SKU, damnit.

I was dumped in the middle of an MSN conversation today::

Friend: I'm slowly watching Utena.
Friend: It's super.
Friend: I'm gonna go watch now.
Friend: *wave emoticon*
Arki: *barely managed to say goodbye*


She loves SKU more than me! emot-frown emot-frown emot-frown I'm proud of her. emot-keke

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#63 | Back to Top07-25-2007 11:52:17 AM

bella
Atlantean Singer
Registered: 11-04-2006
Posts: 581

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

Hiraku wrote:

bella wrote:

One of my friends actually wanted to watch Utena because I talk about it all the time and she wanted to know what the hell I was talking about when I went into my crazy rants. I don't know how she's taking it. She seems to hate Touga and Anthy and Saionji. She'll probably fall in love with Akio.

She hates Anthy already? emot-aaa
Your friend might be on to something here. How did she feel about Kozue and Shiori and Nanami?

Actually, I don't know. She didn't mention them when I asked her how she liked the show so far. (But I certainly can ask her!)  She's only on the first arc, and I know that she hates the filler episodes, which I believe would be the Nanami episodes. She wants to watch the second arc, though, so regardless of who she likes and doesn't like, I'm happy. And as far as hating Anthy, she believes that Anthy is too weak, as in everybody slaps her around. I laughed. She's hating her for all the wrong reasons.


Happy Holidays Everyone! :3

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#64 | Back to Top07-25-2007 02:48:17 PM

Giovanna
Ends of the Fandom
From: Edmonton, AB
Registered: 10-12-2006
Posts: 8797
Website

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

Razara wrote:

I know that you're all trying to help, but I'm getting so sick of being the cause of thread derailment that it's making me not want to talk about Shiori at all. I rarely speak around most people in real life because I find that whenever I say something, it's always something stupid, so I find it better not to talk at all. I'm frequently finding that I feel the same way whenever I post on the forum, and not just about Shiori either.

Razara, I think you're worrying far too much about how we see you. We certainly don't think it's better you not talk at all; you're an insightful and awesome contributor to the forums, and we'd all miss you if you posted less, especially for a reason like that! Yes, you and dollface both are a bit too overprotective of Shiori. Not without reason, but still far more than you have to be, and I think you realize that. You've done very well keeping your defense of Shiori to where it's appropriate, and you should be proud of yourself for that. There's plenty for you to contribute above and beyond the subject of her though, so don't think for a second that you're talking stupid. Or I'll get mad. emot-mad

It's so much easier to be an Akio fan.

But back on topic. emot-keke


Akio, you have nice turns of phrase, but your points aren't clear and you have no textual support. I can't give this a passing grade.
~ Professor Arisa Konno, Eng 1001 (Freshman Literature and Composition)

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#65 | Back to Top07-25-2007 08:10:40 PM

Razara
Marionette Mistress
From: Wuzzy Happy Akio Town (What?)
Registered: 10-17-2006
Posts: 4694

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

Thanks, Gio. emot-smile I'm sorry for being so angsty this morning. emot-gonk

Arki wrote:

I was dumped in the middle of an MSN conversation today::

Friend: I'm slowly watching Utena.
Friend: It's super.
Friend: I'm gonna go watch now.
Friend: *wave emoticon*
Arki: *barely managed to say goodbye*


She loves SKU more than me! emot-frown emot-frown emot-frown I'm proud of her. emot-keke

It's great when friends start to love SKU. My friend's little brother has taken to calling me Shiori. I walked past him in her house before we left for the movies and he said, "Hi, Shiori." And when the two of us were leaving he said, "Bye, Shiori! Bye, Utena!" emot-rofl

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#66 | Back to Top07-25-2007 08:11:24 PM

ShatteredMirror
Yaoi Pet #1
From: Sacramento, CA
Registered: 10-22-2006
Posts: 8858

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

That's so adorable. emot-keke


Pride is not the opposite of shame, but its source.

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#67 | Back to Top07-26-2007 03:34:32 AM

Nilamarthiel
The Icon Icon
From: Northern Michigan
Registered: 02-05-2007
Posts: 3972
Website

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

My friends are really fucking weird.

They all watched the Utena movie once, all together, at my house.

They said it made perfect sense.

What the hell? Are they on drugs? How can you make ANY sense of it the first time through? I *still* don't understand half of it, and I've been watching it twice a month for the last two years!

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#68 | Back to Top07-26-2007 09:54:45 AM

dollface
Postmistress Elf of Subtext
From: North Carolina
Registered: 11-17-2006
Posts: 5086
Website

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

Here comes dollface to help everyone derail things.

Razara wrote:

I know that you're all trying to help, but I'm getting so sick of being the cause of thread derailment that it's making me not want to talk about Shiori at all. I rarely speak around most people in real life because I find that whenever I say something, it's always something stupid, so I find it better not to talk at all. I'm frequently finding that I feel the same way whenever I post on the forum, and not just about Shiori either.

Hush, you. emot-mad You're doing a far better job than I am at keeping your Shiori defense down. Not only that, but every post you make is worth mention, from your Symbolism Game [which takes a lot more work than I'd originally thought!] to your Sims [the Juri jury still cracks me up]. If you stop posting here, I'm going to cry and then hunt you down. I'm not afraid of going back to prison. emot-mad

Anyway, since one of my friends has watched a fair bit of it, another one of my friends wants to watch it now. emot-gonk Me bitching and moaning for years wasn't enough, apparently. But whatever the reason, I'm glad she wants to see it. I think she'll be more open-minded than the other friend, and I'm actually looking forward to watching the whole series in one sitting again. On Aug. 17 we're going to Greensboro for a concert, and I'll go back to her house for the night. We'll be awake enough from the concert to watch it all. emot-biggrin Well, I will at least.


ah, man does not exist; ah, within the darkness; ah, the sound of the waves

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#69 | Back to Top07-26-2007 10:55:00 AM

Razara
Marionette Mistress
From: Wuzzy Happy Akio Town (What?)
Registered: 10-17-2006
Posts: 4694

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

I'm not doing much better at not getting defensive about Shiori. I still don't know when to keep my mouth shut most of the time. emot-gonk

ShatteredMirror wrote:

That's so adorable. emot-keke

When I see how her little brother and his friend interact, I can't help but wonder if that's how Touga and Saionji acted when they were kids. They seem to be going through an experimental phase, or something. It's still funny how they talk about SKU without really even knowing what it is. When we start talking about it, he'll say, "Is that the anime with the gay guys stripping on the car?" (He walked in during one of the camera scenes with Akio and Touga.)

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#70 | Back to Top07-26-2007 10:56:20 PM

xxkiriyamaxx
Wakaba Wrangler
Registered: 07-12-2007
Posts: 16

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

Lady Nilamarthiel wrote:

My friends are really fucking weird.

They all watched the Utena movie once, all together, at my house.

They said it made perfect sense.

What the hell? Are they on drugs? How can you make ANY sense of it the first time through? I *still* don't understand half of it, and I've been watching it twice a month for the last two years!

Hahaha! Something similar happened to me. I took also my friends to my house to watch the Utena Movie. One of them got bored and started to play with my dog just when Utena turns into a car, another one acted like "WTF?? A car??" and the other said like "Well, It kinda makes sense..."

They all said that well, Utena was trying to "break free", and she became the medium for Anthy to break free, the motif and the way, but they didn't really undestand why exactly she had to become a car or why the ring was the Key, they all said it was full of symbols and most of them were "translatable" while other where very cryptic, (like the whole chuchu video...). And I was like "WTF!!! You got it on the first time!!"

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#71 | Back to Top07-27-2007 12:59:39 PM

brian
Atlantean Singer
Registered: 10-22-2006
Posts: 589

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

Actually, they have a point. If you ignore the details and concentrate on the essentials then the movie does make intuitive sense. After all what is Waiting for Godot about? If you ignore all the confusing symbolism you can see it's a play about waiting.  SKU is a movie about freedom.

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#72 | Back to Top08-12-2007 12:27:59 PM

hyaene
Miki Molester
From: germany
Registered: 08-12-2007
Posts: 33

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

hm... after seeing the first dvd i thought: "what a shit", but then, some months after i was kinda bored and decided to gon on with the next episodes and i really enjoyed them. maybe it's something like love at second sight emot-keke.
so everything i would do to make other people watch SKU is telling them to keep on watching.

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#73 | Back to Top08-12-2007 02:07:04 PM

Giovanna
Ends of the Fandom
From: Edmonton, AB
Registered: 10-12-2006
Posts: 8797
Website

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

hyaene wrote:

hm... after seeing the first dvd i thought: "what a shit", but then, some months after i was kinda bored and decided to gon on with the next episodes and i really enjoyed them. maybe it's something like love at second sight emot-keke.
so everything i would do to make other people watch SKU is telling them to keep on watching.

Sadly it's sage advice and completely necessary. SKU just doesn't flatter itself in the first few episodes. I wouldn't even really give the first arc much credit in drawing the people that are naturally drawn to the material later in the series. The point seemed to be more to get the less frisky folk watching...which....aren't us. emot-keke


Akio, you have nice turns of phrase, but your points aren't clear and you have no textual support. I can't give this a passing grade.
~ Professor Arisa Konno, Eng 1001 (Freshman Literature and Composition)

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#74 | Back to Top09-08-2007 02:00:29 PM

MissMocha
Bettie Page Princess
From: Tallahassee, Fl
Registered: 10-19-2006
Posts: 4632

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

I had this conversaiton and thought of this thread! I did convince him to try it when he visits tho. hopefully the hotel room he gets will have a dvd player. 

Aneri Malin [3:41 PM]:  did you ever watch Utena?
Aneri Malin [3:41 PM]:  Revolutionary Girl Utena, rather
Cute Guy [3:42 PM]:  no, never heard of that one
Aneri Malin [3:43 PM]:  that's the only dvds I kept when I did my big anime purge
Aneri Malin [3:43 PM]:  it's great!
Aneri Malin [3:43 PM]:  it's freudian, and there's incest, and it's terrifyingly cymbolic and there's cocktowers
Cute Guy [3:44 PM]:  cocktowers AND incest?
Cute Guy [3:44 PM]:  sold!
Aneri Malin [3:44 PM]:  haha, it's great
Aneri Malin [3:45 PM]:  it's Kuniko Ikuhara, it's crazy
Aneri Malin [3:45 PM]:  dine by, rather
Aneri Malin [3:45 PM]:  DONE
Aneri Malin [3:45 PM]:  the first 6 episodes, and you're all, damn this is just magical girl crap
Aneri Malin [3:45 PM]:  but then it gets crazy in 7
Aneri Malin [3:45 PM]:  and by 14 it's crazy as hell
Cute Guy [3:46 PM]:  sounds like that right down my alley
Cute Guy [3:46 PM]:  well there're no big robots, but i can look past that
Aneri Malin [3:46 PM]:  haha, well, in the movie, the girls do turn into cars
Aneri Malin [3:47 PM]:  and there's a giant planetarium and projector which are evil
Aneri Malin [3:47 PM]:  and an evil elevator
Aneri Malin [3:47 PM]:  actually, one of the things I love about the show is that there really is no cooki-cutter villain of great evil
Aneri Malin [3:47 PM]:  just a bunch of misguided people who think  they know what they want and how ot get it
Cute Guy [3:48 PM]:  huh
Cute Guy [3:48 PM]:  so all these apliances that are evil are sentient as well?
Cute Guy [3:48 PM]:  i guess you'd need sentience to be evil though
I'm Getting Tired Of Replacing His Aim [3:49 PM]:  nvm, stupid question
Aneri Malin [3:49 PM]:  haha, no, actually, they're not evil
Aneri Malin [3:50 PM]:  they're jsut used to either misguide peope or strip them down to their cores
Cute Guy [3:50 PM]:  ahh ok
Cute Guy [3:51 PM]:  i'm not really sure how i'd react to an elevator trying to misguide me or psycho-analyze me
Aneri Malin [3:51 PM]:  oh, no
Aneri Malin [3:52 PM]:  see, you get in the elevator, and the creepy psycho who's manipulating people makes you confess things and then you realize you're not the person you thought you were
Aneri Malin [3:52 PM]:  it's great!
Cute Guy [3:52 PM]:  oh ok
Cute Guy [3:53 PM]:  lol awesome
Cute Guy [3:53 PM]:  i need to sit down an watch that sometime
Aneri Malin [3:53 PM]:  I have every episode and the movie that only can be watched while incredibly drunk
Aneri Malin [3:53 PM]:  I'm told it's great while high, but I've never tried that sort of thing


The first time you looked at her curves you were hooked
And the glances you took, took hold of you and demanded that you stay
And sunk in their teeth, bit your heart and released
Such a charge that you need another touch, another taste, another fix

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#75 | Back to Top09-10-2007 04:33:08 PM

Nocturnalux
Qualified Duellist
From: Portugal
Registered: 09-10-2007
Posts: 741

Re: Getting People to Watch Utena?

I am trying to get a friend of mine to watch Utena: it is working. Him being a philosophy teacher I am looking forward to his interpretations. I introduced the topic of Utena via Neon Genesis Evangelion, like so many people I see a connection between the two. I told him about a comparative study I am planning on doing on Evangelion and Lain (the main point of which would be alienation and identity as perceived in these two animes) and, eventually, on Utena. He was familiar with Lain and Eva but not Utena so I gave him a brief description of the intro that appears in the beginning of some many episodes: a long time ago there was a princess (we all know the rest). I mentioned a few other things that stood out for me without giving out too many plot related issues. Basically, I mentioned the insistence on symbology, the growing emphasis on deconstruction and the breakdown of narrative structures, the underlying emotional entanglement regarding the incest and the importance of motivation in making sense of SKU. I didn't say much about the characters themselves except for an overview of Mikage who is my favourite Utena character.

I found Utena in a very convoluted way. I was reliving my childhood by watching Sailor Moon and decided to browse for essays about it. I found a very good one online that contained a whole essay on Utena. This essay made me very curious to watch Utena, even if up to that point I had never even heard about it or seen as much as a frame. If I had not been forwarned I might have been turned off by the first episodes but I knew that something great was in store. It turns out that I was correct.

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