This is a static copy of In the Rose Garden, which existed as the center of the western Utena fandom for years. Enjoy. :)

#226 | Back to Top02-26-2008 09:30:49 PM

OnlyInThisLight
KING OF ALL DUCKS
Registered: 01-15-2008
Posts: 4412

Re: We Hate SKU!

jayskittles wrote:

I'm sorry about that last post, you guys. I really am. emot-frown

Anyway.
I actually did read the third SKU book today.

GIANT KEVIN SIMON ANYONE?

Dude, look closley at the inside of the trash can ChuChu lands in. emot-dance

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#227 | Back to Top02-27-2008 12:00:33 PM

azuresquirrel
Touga Topper
From: Right behind you!
Registered: 10-16-2006
Posts: 57
Website

Re: We Hate SKU!

Okay, I know a million people have said "THE DUB" a lot already, but no one has covered a specific pet peeve I have with it.

ANTHY'S VA.

I read so many reviews of the English dub pointing her out as one of the better actresses (as compared to her "flat" Japanese VA, WHAT?) when I think she's the worst. Yes, even worse than 30-year-old Mitsuru. As Anthy ties with Juri as my favorite character, her English VA annoys the ever-living crap out of me. Her Japanese VA had line readings that were full of subtle nuances that got the character's layers. Her English VA OVER-ENNUNICATES and OVER-READS every.single. line. She plays Anthy like a fucking melodrama. It's the worst in the final episode, which I watched the dub for just out of curiousity. Racheal Lillis, while perhaps miscast as Utena, acts the ever-loving fuck out of that episode and she's pretty amazing. Anthy? Sounds dead. IN THE MOST EMOTIONAL SCENE OF THE SERIES. BLARGH!

*whew* Maybe went a bit overboard there, but it's good to get that off of my chest. emot-biggrin


Me on gender identity: "I have more gender issues than an anime character."

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#228 | Back to Top02-27-2008 01:24:21 PM

BalamiyaVardihi
High Tripper
From: New Jersey
Registered: 12-16-2007
Posts: 243

Re: We Hate SKU!

azuresquirrel wrote:

Okay, I know a million people have said "THE DUB" a lot already, but no one has covered a specific pet peeve I have with it.

ANTHY'S VA.

I read so many reviews of the English dub pointing her out as one of the better actresses (as compared to her "flat" Japanese VA, WHAT?) when I think she's the worst. Yes, even worse than 30-year-old Mitsuru. As Anthy ties with Juri as my favorite character, her English VA annoys the ever-living crap out of me. Her Japanese VA had line readings that were full of subtle nuances that got the character's layers. Her English VA OVER-ENNUNICATES and OVER-READS every.single. line. She plays Anthy like a fucking melodrama. It's the worst in the final episode, which I watched the dub for just out of curiousity. Racheal Lillis, while perhaps miscast as Utena, acts the ever-loving fuck out of that episode and she's pretty amazing. Anthy? Sounds dead. IN THE MOST EMOTIONAL SCENE OF THE SERIES. BLARGH!

*whew* Maybe went a bit overboard there, but it's good to get that off of my chest. emot-biggrin

YES! poptart I agree totally. I love her original voice actress, and her dub voice...no.


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#229 | Back to Top02-27-2008 06:06:05 PM

My_Friend_Todd
Juri Jeerer
From: Shittiest place on Earth :D
Registered: 02-25-2008
Posts: 46

Re: We Hate SKU!

BalamiyaVardihi wrote:

azuresquirrel wrote:

Okay, I know a million people have said "THE DUB" a lot already, but no one has covered a specific pet peeve I have with it.

ANTHY'S VA.

I read so many reviews of the English dub pointing her out as one of the better actresses (as compared to her "flat" Japanese VA, WHAT?) when I think she's the worst. Yes, even worse than 30-year-old Mitsuru. As Anthy ties with Juri as my favorite character, her English VA annoys the ever-living crap out of me. Her Japanese VA had line readings that were full of subtle nuances that got the character's layers. Her English VA OVER-ENNUNICATES and OVER-READS every.single. line. She plays Anthy like a fucking melodrama. It's the worst in the final episode, which I watched the dub for just out of curiousity. Racheal Lillis, while perhaps miscast as Utena, acts the ever-loving fuck out of that episode and she's pretty amazing. Anthy? Sounds dead. IN THE MOST EMOTIONAL SCENE OF THE SERIES. BLARGH!

*whew* Maybe went a bit overboard there, but it's good to get that off of my chest. emot-biggrin

YES! poptart I agree totally. I love her original voice actress, and her dub voice...no.

Yea...emot-gonk
Me, personally, I like the original voicings for the characters better.
I don't mind the english, in fact...there are some english voices I like in there. The one that scares me the most, though, would have to be Saionji's
(Kevin Simon XD)


Oh, Hai Gaiz!
emot-biggrin

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#230 | Back to Top02-27-2008 08:15:57 PM

Frosty
Everyone's Best Friend
From: United States
Registered: 11-16-2006
Posts: 1269
Website

Re: We Hate SKU!

azuresquirrel wrote:

Okay, I know a million people have said "THE DUB" a lot already, but no one has covered a specific pet peeve I have with it.

ANTHY'S VA.

I read so many reviews of the English dub pointing her out as one of the better actresses (as compared to her "flat" Japanese VA, WHAT?) when I think she's the worst.

I'll chime in and agree. That voice is AWFUL.

I loved the show before I was able to watch it, read all the fan pages, had the scripts down, and I came in KNOWING I'd worship the ground Anthy walked on. And then... she spoke (in English). My God, I couldn't have been more shocked and surprised when Anthy opened her mouth, as when I first heard Mike Tyson speak! I had to make a conscious decision not to let her irritating voice ruin my appreciation for the character. I had to play mind games with myself, saying "Well, since Anthy's inner-motivations are a mystery, perhaps having the voice of a cheerful zombie check-out girl will enhance that mystique." 

IT'S HORRIBLE!!! D:


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#231 | Back to Top02-28-2008 01:08:40 PM

dollface
Postmistress Elf of Subtext
From: North Carolina
Registered: 11-17-2006
Posts: 5086
Website

Re: We Hate SKU!

I think that Anthy's VA, much like a few others, weren't exactly awful, but I feel like they were picked to fit one specific part of the character. There are a few times in the series where I actually found that (don't kill me!) Akio's English VA may have been more suited than the original. Not all the time, certainly for Akio and Anthy, but at certain moments, it felt really right, and I think that this may be what was heard in the casting. I've expressed before that I have nothing but praise for Shiori's English VA because I felt that her Japanese counterpart was too... whiney, too girly. However, Lisa Oritz was able to really capture Shiori's cruel side, which is why I feel she was cast. Her innocence differed greatly between the two versions; her Japanese came off as childish, if not peurile, while the English was more that of a teenaged girl who didn't understand. Sometimes, she could be compared to Utena. But, anyway, this isn't a post about Shiori, I swear! Point being, Anthy sounded really out of place through a lot of the scenes, but there were a few key moments when I felt her English voice wasn't all bad.


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#232 | Back to Top02-28-2008 06:12:16 PM

azuresquirrel
Touga Topper
From: Right behind you!
Registered: 10-16-2006
Posts: 57
Website

Re: We Hate SKU!

I will say that Shiori's English VA was one of the few I enjoyed. Basically I felt like her and Crispin Freeman and sometimes Racheal Lillis and Wakaba's VA were the only ones who treated their characters like actual human beings. emot-tongue Maybe I'm being a bit hard on the dub, but as I pointed out, it has its good actors! I just would never want THAT dub played on TV (like any American TV station would ever play Utena in the first place, but whatever).


Me on gender identity: "I have more gender issues than an anime character."

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#233 | Back to Top02-28-2008 07:33:32 PM

My_Friend_Todd
Juri Jeerer
From: Shittiest place on Earth :D
Registered: 02-25-2008
Posts: 46

Re: We Hate SKU!

Well....I guess it's better than the fact that every time I hear Utena speak (In English)...I think of Jessie from Pokemon.
I want to think of Utena when I hear Utena! D=
Not some psyco with a bad perm! @~@ (sorry...not a big Jessie fan)
That and she sounds too womanly for her age.
But I agree that Anthy could have gotten a better actress.


Oh, Hai Gaiz!
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#234 | Back to Top02-28-2008 08:29:23 PM

jayskittles
Saionji Slapper
From: Arizona
Registered: 02-10-2008
Posts: 26

Re: We Hate SKU!

OnlyInThisLight wrote:

jayskittles wrote:

I'm sorry about that last post, you guys. I really am. emot-frown

Anyway.
I actually did read the third SKU book today.

GIANT KEVIN SIMON ANYONE?

Dude, look closley at the inside of the trash can ChuChu lands in. emot-dance

Holy fucking shit....

Ahem.

(Sekritly I adore every dub voice. Even Saionji's. And I love their Enoki names. Kevin Simon is such a cute name.



I'm going to hell aren't I?)

Ok, I'll say it,

Anthy's 'do makes her head look like a purple rotisserie chicken with specs.


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#235 | Back to Top02-28-2008 09:31:16 PM

OnlyInThisLight
KING OF ALL DUCKS
Registered: 01-15-2008
Posts: 4412

Re: We Hate SKU!

It really really bothers me that when they had Nanami stumble *coughpeepcouch* in on Touga in the shower, they made him look like he had no penis.  I mean, the wall-shower-screen-semi-see-through-divider-plot-device-thingy had some darker colored rose designs on it, couldn't they have had one cover that area as opposed to censoring it in such a ridiculous fashion by removing it?


Maybe there wasn't a rose design big enough?

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#236 | Back to Top02-29-2008 01:01:19 AM

BenHo
Juri Jeerer
Registered: 01-30-2008
Posts: 41

Re: We Hate SKU!

Maybe it's the fact that I'm a visual whore, but I was never impressed with the animation. seriously, the only reason I got into the show was to laugh at the horrible animation in season one. I got attached to the characters though. I'd love to see the utena anime reanimated. the stories great, characters are wonderful, art makes me throw up in my mouth.

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#237 | Back to Top02-29-2008 01:12:38 AM

Tamago
God of Comedy
From: Minami Goushuu
Registered: 10-17-2006
Posts: 14280
Website

Re: We Hate SKU!

BenHo wrote:

Maybe it's the fact that I'm a visual whore, but I was never impressed with the animation. seriously, the only reason I got into the show was to laugh at the horrible animation in season one. I got attached to the characters though. I'd love to see the utena anime reanimated. the stories great, characters are wonderful, art makes me throw up in my mouth.

If the remake had the same quality animation as the movie but without the escessively large eyes.

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#238 | Back to Top02-29-2008 01:24:48 AM

Ashnod
La poétesse revolutionnaire
From: Missouri, United States
Registered: 03-01-2007
Posts: 1243
Website

Re: We Hate SKU!

OnlyInThisLight wrote:

It really really bothers me that when they had Nanami stumble *coughpeepcouch* in on Touga in the shower, they made him look like he had no penis.  I mean, the wall-shower-screen-semi-see-through-divider-plot-device-thingy had some darker colored rose designs on it, couldn't they have had one cover that area as opposed to censoring it in such a ridiculous fashion by removing it?


Maybe there wasn't a rose design big enough?

Or it's small enough that it wasn't necessary. school-devil


Flowers without names blooming in the field can only sway in the wind. But I was born with a destiny of roses, born to live in passion and glory.

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#239 | Back to Top02-29-2008 02:26:52 PM

BalamiyaVardihi
High Tripper
From: New Jersey
Registered: 12-16-2007
Posts: 243

Re: We Hate SKU!

Tamago wrote:

BenHo wrote:

Maybe it's the fact that I'm a visual whore, but I was never impressed with the animation. seriously, the only reason I got into the show was to laugh at the horrible animation in season one. I got attached to the characters though. I'd love to see the utena anime reanimated. the stories great, characters are wonderful, art makes me throw up in my mouth.

If the remake had the same quality animation as the movie but without the escessively large eyes.

I agree; the movie's animation was breathtaking and spectacular. But then again, there were some parts when the anime's animation was really decent.


Twirling round with this familiar parabol
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Celebrate this chance to be alive and breathing

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#240 | Back to Top02-29-2008 07:49:20 PM

Adrasteia
Memorial Hollerer
From: Newfoundland, Canada
Registered: 11-15-2007
Posts: 694
Website

Re: We Hate SKU!

dollface wrote:

I think that Anthy's VA, much like a few others, weren't exactly awful, but I feel like they were picked to fit one specific part of the character. There are a few times in the series where I actually found that (don't kill me!) Akio's English VA may have been more suited than the original.

Really? That's such an odd thing to say! emot-tongue Absolutely no offense meant, but Akio's voice made me go out and search for other animes with the same seiyuu - it made me melt(not quite like Gio, but almost.) I adored how strong and deep they went for that character. To me, it really emanated his irresistable power and sexuality.

I was appalled when movie Akio started speaking(in Japanese) - he sounded like an awkward teenage boy! emot-gonk Why would they do that?

I'm pretty much turned off by all english dubs, so it could be my own personal bias which made me hate Anthy's english voice. But, when she was in Akio's tower with Utena and Wakaba, and started laughing, the "HEE. HEE. HEE. HEE." noise that came out nearly brought me to tears. I love her empty, stale Japanese voice. etc-love

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#241 | Back to Top03-21-2008 08:02:24 PM

dollface
Postmistress Elf of Subtext
From: North Carolina
Registered: 11-17-2006
Posts: 5086
Website

Re: We Hate SKU!

I really only mention that because on the Long Legged Older Man site, in the section dedicated to his voice, the only clip of his English dub was from episode 13-- where he had no character, and his voice certainly wasn't right. As he was developed more in the series, especially in the last two arcs, I have no shame in saying that his English voice was sexy. His VA came more into the character and learned to voice him. I don't think he was poorly cast at all. Frankly, I can't think of a single English VA better suited.


I didn't know where this would be fitting, but this is as good a place as any... one thing that drives me crazy for no apparent reason is the whole identical-twin thing. Miki and Kozue are male and female respectively, meaning that they are fraternal twins. They don't have to resemble each other any more than Touga and Nanami do. But still, everyone always comment on how they look just alike, Utena going so far as to imply that if it weren't for the different gender, they would be exactly the same (not in these exact words, but she does say that "the only difference between you is that you're a girl"). I mean, as far as anime goes, they do look alike. But as far as twins go, I don't think they even look identical-- their eyes are different shades (in the movie, I think they might actually be two different colors entirely), Kozue's hair is significantly darker (and in some scenes, it becomes purple), the cuts of their hair are similar but not the same, and because Kozue is female, she is often colored slightly more fair-skinned. I adore Kozue and Miki, don't get me wrong. But I can't help how much this gets under my skin. I mean, if Touga and Nanami are the standard for how much siblings should look alike, I suppose that could make Miki and Kozue a hell of a lot closer to twins... but considering that their main differences also apply to Akio and Anthy, I think my frustration is still valid.

Last edited by dollface (03-21-2008 08:03:14 PM)


ah, man does not exist; ah, within the darkness; ah, the sound of the waves

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#242 | Back to Top03-21-2008 08:34:48 PM

BioKraze
Faceless Master
From: Yuma, Arizona (USA)
Registered: 11-26-2006
Posts: 8282

Re: We Hate SKU!

Very astute of you to note that the Kaoru twins are fraternal and not identical. Most people I know don't know the difference between the two.

Good job! emot-keke

I suppose when I watch more of the series, I'll have something to hate about it...


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#243 | Back to Top03-21-2008 08:35:21 PM

Raven Nightshade
Someday Shiner
From: Louisiana
Registered: 12-17-2006
Posts: 2925

Re: We Hate SKU!

I always thought that Kozue and Miki had the same haircut, but Miki keeps his brushed down while Kozue makes hers all wild and flippy. It's an amusing dichotomy because they're two halves of the same whole; Kozue is the wild and Miki is the mild, as represented by their hair.

Last edited by Raven Nightshade (03-21-2008 08:37:51 PM)


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#244 | Back to Top03-21-2008 09:11:21 PM

Razara
Marionette Mistress
From: Wuzzy Happy Akio Town (What?)
Registered: 10-17-2006
Posts: 4694

Re: We Hate SKU!

dollface wrote:

Identical, despite not being identical

I couldn't agree more. Given that they're fraternal twins, they should look just as similar as any brother and sister, and the differences in their appearance are clear in the way they're drawn. Then again, I've heard of pairs of male and female twins being asked if they're identical, not because they look alike, but because the person asking was stupid. With that in mind, I can easily imagine Utena making a comment about how their gender is their only difference the moment she notices that the two twins have similar hair cuts. If Kozue grew her hair out, and if they weren't two out of four people in the world with blue hair, then people might not realize that they're twins as easily.

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#245 | Back to Top03-25-2008 07:36:13 PM

Coco Melancholy
Framed Landscaper
Registered: 06-04-2007
Posts: 415

Re: We Hate SKU!

OnlyInThisLight wrote:

> Nanjiminkin should have done the english dubbing for Utena and ChuChu.

I agree XD Nanjimikin should have done the whole dub

OnlyInThisLight wrote:

> I cannot honestly believe that such a huge, up-scale academy like Ohtori that has UNIFORMS would not include a rule in the dress code saying that girl's and boy's had to wear their specific gender-assigned uniforms. My school doesn't have uniforms, and even it bans blantant cross-dressing in it's dress code. And even then.....Utena's outfit is so drastically altered that it can hardly be described as that school's male uniform.

As far as I can tell there is one since the counsellor is always telling Utena off for crossdressing.

OnlyInThisLight wrote:

Nanami's council uniform would have been so cool looking if they had just chose a more flattering shade of yellow. Anthy's and Akio's outfits grew on me as the series progessed but her's always grated on my nerves.

emot-gonk I have a terrible feeling I'm the only one who likes that uniform, I always thought it was pretty kickass.

Epi_lepsia wrote:

Okay so my main complain about the series are the goddamn UNIFORMS. I mean, they are HORRIBLE!!! Specially male uniforms.

Omg yes. And what gets me the most is that Utena's uniform if it had trousers instead of shorts, would probably be more closer to a typical male uniform than those green alien monstrosities.


My_Friend_Todd wrote:

Okay...one last thing before all of my posts obliterate this poor topic D8

Sainji (Kevin Simon XD)'s english voice in the movie! Umigawsh!! *saws ears off*
He sounds a little too much like Muraki (Yami No Matsuei) for me to tolerate it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44BS88TOCKs

(Muraki's the guy in white, for those of you who either don't know or are under-informed)

I can't stand Muraki and he kills our poor Saionji by having the same nasally voice emot-gonk

Take that back this instance!! *rage* Do you honestly believe any self-respecting Yami no Matsuei fan would touch that piece of trough known as it's dub. Do you know how many fans have monitors wearing holes from various parts of their anatomy connecting with the screen in a hopeless desire to make what was once a sexy and deep and frightening Muraki now turned into something akin to chalk on a black-board stop. Well do you. Do you!! *__* that man shouldn't be let anywhere near animated art. (currently suffering flashbacks)


On another note I think I might go youtube now and check out the dub. I'm kinda curious now.

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#246 | Back to Top03-25-2008 07:50:06 PM

Adrasteia
Memorial Hollerer
From: Newfoundland, Canada
Registered: 11-15-2007
Posts: 694
Website

Re: We Hate SKU!

My_Friend_Todd wrote:

Well....I guess it's better than the fact that every time I hear Utena speak (In English)...I think of Jessie from Pokemon.
.

Fun Fact: Utena's English voice actress actually voiced Misty from Pokemon. She also voiced Jigglypuff.

I read an interview with the actress a few weeks ago, who stated that, when working on SKU, she "didn't really understand what was going on the entire time, and just went with it."

Sounds like Utena, at least.

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#247 | Back to Top03-26-2008 12:25:33 AM

jayskittles
Saionji Slapper
From: Arizona
Registered: 02-10-2008
Posts: 26

Re: We Hate SKU!

Coco Melancholy wrote:

OnlyInThisLight wrote:

> Nanjiminkin should have done the english dubbing for Utena and ChuChu.

I agree XD Nanjimikin should have done the whole dub

OnlyInThisLight wrote:

> I cannot honestly believe that such a huge, up-scale academy like Ohtori that has UNIFORMS would not include a rule in the dress code saying that girl's and boy's had to wear their specific gender-assigned uniforms. My school doesn't have uniforms, and even it bans blantant cross-dressing in it's dress code. And even then.....Utena's outfit is so drastically altered that it can hardly be described as that school's male uniform.

As far as I can tell there is one since the counsellor is always telling Utena off for crossdressing.

OnlyInThisLight wrote:

Nanami's council uniform would have been so cool looking if they had just chose a more flattering shade of yellow. Anthy's and Akio's outfits grew on me as the series progessed but her's always grated on my nerves.

emot-gonk I have a terrible feeling I'm the only one who likes that uniform, I always thought it was pretty kickass.

Epi_lepsia wrote:

Okay so my main complain about the series are the goddamn UNIFORMS. I mean, they are HORRIBLE!!! Specially male uniforms.

Omg yes. And what gets me the most is that Utena's uniform if it had trousers instead of shorts, would probably be more closer to a typical male uniform than those green alien monstrosities.


My_Friend_Todd wrote:

Okay...one last thing before all of my posts obliterate this poor topic D8

Sainji (Kevin Simon XD)'s english voice in the movie! Umigawsh!! *saws ears off*
He sounds a little too much like Muraki (Yami No Matsuei) for me to tolerate it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44BS88TOCKs

(Muraki's the guy in white, for those of you who either don't know or are under-informed)

I can't stand Muraki and he kills our poor Saionji by having the same nasally voice emot-gonk

Take that back this instance!! *rage* Do you honestly believe any self-respecting Yami no Matsuei fan would touch that piece of trough known as it's dub. Do you know how many fans have monitors wearing holes from various parts of their anatomy connecting with the screen in a hopeless desire to make what was once a sexy and deep and frightening Muraki now turned into something akin to chalk on a black-board stop. Well do you. Do you!! *__* that man shouldn't be let anywhere near animated art. (currently suffering flashbacks)


On another note I think I might go youtube now and check out the dub. I'm kinda curious now.

pssst. that nasally chalkboard voice kinda turns me on. emot-smile


who wrinkled my randy travis poster
pissed in the seat
and stole my keys

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#248 | Back to Top03-26-2008 06:17:15 AM

Coco Melancholy
Framed Landscaper
Registered: 06-04-2007
Posts: 415

Re: We Hate SKU!

jayskittles wrote:

pssst. that nasally chalkboard voice kinda turns me on.

emot-gonkemot-gonkemot-gonkemot-gonkemot-gonk

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#249 | Back to Top03-26-2008 03:07:11 PM

jayskittles
Saionji Slapper
From: Arizona
Registered: 02-10-2008
Posts: 26

Re: We Hate SKU!

Coco Melancholy wrote:

jayskittles wrote:

pssst. that nasally chalkboard voice kinda turns me on.

emot-gonkemot-gonkemot-gonkemot-gonkemot-gonk

emot-biggrin


who wrinkled my randy travis poster
pissed in the seat
and stole my keys

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#250 | Back to Top03-26-2008 03:24:14 PM

Sey
Our Sicilian Prince
From: S. Cataldo, Sicily, Italy
Registered: 10-16-2006
Posts: 268
Website

Re: We Hate SKU!

I hate SKU because Ruka wasn't allowed to had a multi sex session with Juri emot-mad


Your lovely "That's Amore" IRG User.

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