I think she means this look:



I thought that was more of a knowing smirk, not necessarily anything with sexual overtones directed at Tsuwabuki. (Although the thought intruigues me, hmm. )

I don't think Mikage became a fully-fledged pedophile, despite his rather sensual posture when he had the meeting with Miki. It could be that he's like Touga and Akio, who simply ooze sexuality even with people they have no real intention of screwing.

morosemocha wrote:

Utena and Mikage have such interesting parrallels when it comes to their superiorities and inferiorities. But then, they are each other, just totally different.

Hush! Someone else is going to get the idea to write an essay on it, and I'm still only halfway through my own!

And, of course, you are right - Utena and Mikage are, in so many ways, the same - Utena is just what one can view as the "light" version and Mikage as the "dark" version. Had they been in different circumstances, I'm sure Utena could've been the dark to Mikage's light.

Thanks for the link, Gio.

Anyway, so now that I think it seems fairly certain that Mikage has a penchant for boys, the question is why?

With Mamiya, it makes sense in context - perhaps Nemuro felt some not-so-platonic feelings towards Mamiya before he became Mikage - I honestly think that, had Akio not intervened, Nemuro would not have gone the Mikage-pedo route. I think the full-out pedophilia set in thanks in large part to Akio and his manipulating ways - there was potential there, but not every person with pedophiliac leanings actually becomes a pedophile (an excellent example would be Hans Christian Andersen - tons of evidence towards him liking children a bit too much, but absolutely no evidence that he ever actually acted on it).

So, Akio encourages any sort of deviant feelings (I myself do not like the term 'deviant', but in the case of pedophilia I think most of us can agree this is a deviant behavior) Nemuro has for Mamiya, so that when Nemuro becomes Mikage, he actually acts on the pedophiliac leanings of Nemuro towards Anthy!Mamiya. So, in the grand scheme of things, Mikage's being involved with Anthy!Mamiya make sense, but it makes me wonder why Mikage shows sexual interest in Mitsuru and Miki - it would seem to suggest that he is, in fact, a full-blown pedophile.

So, uh, why? Anyone feel like speculating based on what we see? I could always guess he was molested as a child, but we don't see any actual evidence in the show of this (well, unless you count his pedophilia, of course) - unless, maybe I'm missing some bit of the show.

Now, on a related note, what exactly defines a pedophile? Is a person whom desires children but never acts on it an actual pedophile? Or must one act on their desire for a child to be considered a pedophile?

Yeah, I follow - although, I would agree with previous statements form others on the thread suggesting his love for Tokiko was a confusing mix of love for a maternal figure and a sexual love.

Its funny, I've never actually thought of Mikage as 'gay' exactly - just as a pedophile. I mean, I can't picture Mikage going after Saionji or Touga, for instance (which is technically still pedophilia in parts of the world, but they're 17, so it doesn't exactly fall on the same level as seducing Mitsuru would).

Of course, Mikage's physical age and actual age are completely different - he's physically 18, but he's been around for a LOT longer.

And, this begs the question: how old was Nemuro before he became Mikage?

It seems like Mikage, at this point, is actually probably in the 35 to 50 age range - chronologically, it would seem he's closer to 35 or so, but this is Ohtori Academy we're talking about, so chronology isn't exactly a solid thing. I'd lean more towards him supposed to be in his 50's because Tokiko certainly looks like she is when we see her in present times - the wrinkles are the real tip-off here.

But I do consider Mikage a pedophile - Anthy!Mamiya physically looks to be around 12 years old (and real Mamiya looks like he could be as young as 11 yrs. old), and Mitsuru is 10 years old.

But, again, to go back to my original question, why is Mikage a pedophile?

Last edited by A Day Without Me (01-17-2007 02:00:33 PM)

I believe that Nemuro was only 18-19, very early twenties, at tops. Remember that he mentioned of being the same age as his students, who seemed quite young, as well. He was a genious, after all.

Physically he's that age. I believe A Day Without Me was referring to mentally.

Chronologically we know that Mikage is quite a bit older than Nemuro was at the time of Mamiya's death. And we know that he hasn't phsyically changed since that time. The question is if he has matured mentally or not over his extended years. Does he even realize how old he is?

That line of reasoning can run off into all sorts of directions, such as asking what maturity really is or how it can be defined and measured.

In Mikage's case there's too much uncertainty to say whether he can be classified as a pedophile in any official sense. What we can see is a definite attraction to 'Mamiya' as well as sexual overtones towards Miki and Tsuwabuki. In these three cases it is an attraction towards boys who are several years younger than Mikage is.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Mikage doesn't show physical interest in Utena. Even when he associates her as Tokiko returned to him, he doesn't seem to have any attraction towards her anymore. He instead wants to validate himself to her, which he failed to do with the burning of the hall. (Maybe the creepy as hell look he gives Utena when they're in front of the pictures counts?)

Ragnarok wrote:

Chronologically we know that Mikage is quite a bit older than Nemuro was at the time of Mamiya's death. And we know that he hasn't phsyically changed since that time. The question is if he has matured mentally or not over his extended years. Does he even realize how old he is?

That line of reasoning can run off into all sorts of directions, such as asking what maturity really is or how it can be defined and measured.

The whole age thing is so messed up in Utena - I don't think Mikage has really matured mentally very much since real!Mamiya died and Tokiko left. And he hasn't aged physically. The best term I can come up with is 'chronologically', which isn't really the right term given SKU's issues with chronology, and chronologically speaking, I'd say if he had been in the real world the whole time he'd be in that 35 to 50 range (but, again, I deifnitely lean towards the 50 end as opposed to the 35 end).

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Mikage doesn't show physical interest in Utena. Even when he associates her as Tokiko returned to him, he doesn't seem to have any attraction towards her anymore. He instead wants to validate himself to her, which he failed to do with the burning of the hall. (Maybe the creepy as hell look he gives Utena when they're in front of the pictures counts?)

Yeah, I never sensed there being any interest in Mikage towards Utena - and there certainly isn't any towards Tokiko when she stops by his office after talking to Akio and saying she notices neither of them has aged at all. Maybe Nemuro would've shown a slight attraction to Utena, but Mikage sure as hell doesn't.

A Day Without Me wrote:

Yeah, I never sensed there being any interest in Mikage towards Utena - and there certainly isn't any towards Tokiko when she stops by his office after talking to Akio and saying she notices neither of them has aged at all. Maybe Nemuro would've shown a slight attraction to Utena, but Mikage sure as hell doesn't.

Other way around; she walks by him on the way to Akio's. And wow he doesn't notice her at all...was she so hard to recognize with long hair? Or is it really that unimportant to recall what she looked like? He doesn't recognize the original Mamiya at first either, right? Strange it's not Tokiko he even kept a picture of, but then...is that picture Anthy's Mamiya or is it really Mamiya and he just sees it like everything else as an illusion?

I gotta say it's still really strange we see no evidence of a sexual or romantic interest in Utena...or any other female members of the cast, for that matter. His secretary comments on how distant he is. There's the incident with Nanami, but I suspect that was just plain an act to get the desired effect for Tsuwabuki. He plays finger-sucky with Mamiya in dark rooms, but nothing at all suggests an interest in women.

On the other hand, there was the lipstick on the cup, which is a very feminine thing to pay attention to...but that was Nemuro. Could you read between enough lines to conclude Mikage turned out only really interested in boys? This has been driving me nuts all through capping the arc, I mean the evidence is there, but but but..

Giovanna wrote:

Other way around; she walks by him on the way to Akio's. And wow he doesn't notice her at all...was she so hard to recognize with long hair? Or is it really that unimportant to recall what she looked like?

I've always assumed Mikage would expect Tokiko to appear the same age as she was when he last saw her. As he himself is unchanged, he expects the same to hold true for everyone. Therefore, in his mind the woman he walks past is simply too old to be Tokiko.

Giovanna wrote:

He doesn't recognize the original Mamiya at first either, right? Strange it's not Tokiko he even kept a picture of, but then...is that picture Anthy's Mamiya or is it really Mamiya and he just sees it like everything else as an illusion?

Well it's a picture of both 'Mamiya' and Tokiko, which then changes to the real Mamiya and Tokiko.

brian wrote:

Maybe Anthy and Akio really do have the ability to change a person's sexual orientation. It would explain a lot of the puzzlement over Mikage, Utena, and perhaps other characters.

Or maybe Akio and Anthy just have magic sex wands that they wave over everyone and... uhh... then they... uhhh... sex?

I'm sorry, its quite late and my heat is broken, so I'm not thinking too swiftly.

Some people in this thread wrote:

Mikage shows no real interest in the girls only the guys.

You know, he looks like a young boy 8D