This was my bad, wasn't it? ;

From the flashback in episode 9:

Man1:  Hey, you there!
Man1:  You two haven't seen a girl about your age around here, have you?
Touga:  What happened?
Man1:  There was a girl who lost her parents in an accident today.
Man1:  She disappeared when we weren't looking.

That's about as specific as the series ever got about Utena's parents, IIRC. The script doesn't actually say it was a car accident - I must have misremembered that detail - so I'm not sure if that was something that came from the official subs (or maybe even the dub) or if it's just fans like us filling in the gaps on our own. Actually, seeing the raw Japanese script might be useful, as translations do vary... help, anyone?

As for Utena's age at the time, the manga's prologue says she was six, but I don't think the series ever specified it; I've mostly seen it assumed that she was about seven. Touga and Saionji are three years older than her, so if she was six or seven, then they would've been nine or ten.

MikoGalatea wrote:

That's about as specific as the series ever got about Utena's parents, IIRC. The script doesn't actually say it was a car accident - I must have misremembered that detail - so I'm not sure if that was something that came from the official subs (or maybe even the dub) or if it's just fans like us filling in the gaps on our own. Actually, seeing the raw Japanese script might be useful, as translations do vary... help, anyone?

That's a very good idea.  I went back and listened to the scene a few times.  My Japanese fu is not high enough to completely transcribe his line -- he's speaking quite fast and slurring a little -- but I'm 95% sure that he doesn't specify what kind of accident.  He definitely says "jiko," which is an accident, but he clearly doesn't say "koutsuu jiko," which would be the usual way of specifying a traffic accident.  So no, I don't think canon gives us an unambiguous answer to this question.

But if you make a list of what kinds of accidents can kill two people at once, both presumed to be young to middle-aged adults, I think it's a pretty short list.  I don't think the word "jiko" would have been used if it had been a fire or natural disaster of some kind.  It's reasonable to conclude that a car accident is a strong possibility, but it's not canonical.

Ok.... I was reading this thread.... and I feel really stupid for sharing this though XD (I don't know if there's a thread for this and I thought it may have been too stupid sounding to make it's own thread XP but I theory I just though of! (oh.... and spoilers for those who haven't finished)

What if Anthy killed Utena's parents? I really need to re-watch the student council saga, but the coffin's have the rose emblem on the, right? Utena was meant to be the new Rose Bride (maybe I'm confusing it with the manga where I remember for sure she was the chosen one, but she was "chosen" in the anime as well, right?) for Akio... Since Anthy was willing to go to such extremes, maybe it was all her doing so Akio had someone when she met her fate to take on her role.

Haha I feel like I just discovered something everyone else has already known about XD

gorgeousshutin , I'm very scattered with my thoughts so please forgive me Also, as much as I love Utena and have seen it/watched it, a LOT has gone over my head I believe so bare with me

In the manga, the castle is real and everyone goes up (the student council I mean, only Utena, Anthy and Touga actually getting to the main part, the others become trapped by Anthy is coffins) and when they do Akio is there and he says that the only real ring belonged to Utena, so I guess yes it is what you said, it's similar in a way to the anime (I think Utena's was "real", the student council couldn't have won) but Anthy stabbed Utena in the anime (see, I'm mixing them up aren't I? LOL) after Utena wouldn't be Akio's "bride", I need to watch that again don't I lol. but Isn't she given the chance to be his "princess" ? After he takes the sword she made with her bond with Anthy, she doesn't want to be Akio's. It's when she refuses that Anthy turns on her, she was anyways, but with Utena going along with the plan she didn't have to do anything drastic

again, sorry for my scatterbrain

Giovanna wrote:

Out of curiosity, does anyone recall whether it specifies car accident in the manga? Yasha seems pretty sure it does, and that they died in a car accident has been fanon for so long now I don't even know where it came from.

I just had a flip through the prologue, and no - it doesn't mention any kind of accident at all. Here's as much detail as it gives:

Page 14
Yurika: Utena's parents died when she was six. I was still young myself, and I couldn't explain it to her. All I could do was cry and tell her, "Your mother and father are far, far away right now, but they love you very much. Do you understand?" Then Utena told me, "Please don't cry... Utena will stay with Auntie instead, until they come back to get me..."

Page 21
Utena: ... that day seven years ago, when I finally knew - that my mom and dad were never coming back. Nobody had told me, not even Aunt Yurika. But the skies were crying...

What about the dubbed version of episode 9? Because I'm getting to think the car accident thing came about because of fans jumping to conclusions however long ago.

I love how the way "Jiko" (By Kanji, Ji is event, Ko can be either past, reason, or origin) is broadly used by Japanese Media to mean "Incident", so, as long as the TV series does not specific otherwise, the possibilities of murder, robbery, terrorism, various Double A conspiracy theories will be endless for fan speculation purpose!

edited to add:
Another example of jiko used as "incident" is the Okuda Railway Crossing Incident (奥田踏切事故), which reads as okuda fumikiri jiko

edited to add:

YuzuKelly wrote:
but Anthy stabbed Utena in the anime (see, I'm mixing them up aren't I? LOL) after Utena wouldn't be Akio's "bride", I need to watch that again don't I lol.

Oh, in the TV, Akio was after Utena's soul sword all along - where she is to become bride to him seems almost unimportant in that ep - it was just the Sword he was after.  Anthy backstabbed Utena when she would not give Akio the S Sword.

Last edited by gorgeousshutin (09-08-2012 02:15:13 PM)

it can be an accident where a train strikes a human, like a jinshin jiko.

Hey, Satyreyes.

Actually, from what I know, the "jinshin jiko", which english translates to "human accident", is strictly used in for purposeful suicide of people throwing themselves onto railways in front of approaching trains.  My English level might not be all encompassing, but I don't think suicide qualifies as "accident" as in "not on purpose".

I myself is Chinese fluent (which gave me an amount of understanding in the Chinese derived Kanji, even though the exact same characters often do mean different things from Chinese to Japanese), and have watched a few Japanese TV live drama where I remember jiko being used to describe terrorism (I think live drama Bloody Monday is one of them, but I can't be sure).  Though, for Ikuhara purpose, the Tokyo Subway Attack is actually the 地下鉄サリン事件, Chikatetsu Sarin Jiken;  Where the "Ji"= "事" is the same as that in Jiko, but the "ko"="故" is replaced by "ken"="件"; jiken means "event", and I do know this one an be used to mean "incident".

But you are absolutely right:  I too, might also have been jumping to conclusion in this (and life dramas are not as technical as actual news in word term usage).  Jiko and jiken are, after all, different things.  So, until I find actual real life cases where "jiko" can be used interchangably with "jiken", I too should not jump to conclusions yet.

Oh, and about the Hen in Honnouji no Hen; the final "Hen" definitely means "change", which in Asian thought frequently applies to change of loyalty/betrayal (though in Kanji, Hen also often means "weird" - Hentai means perverse).   There is a famous historical event in China that is similarly named/worded, thus why, on this one case, I am pretty sure about what I wrote.

*shameless fanfic promotion*

Utena's mother died in a synchronization experiment at NERV, and her father committed suicide in grief.

Ashnod wrote:
*shameless fanfic promotion*

Utena's mother died in a synchronization experiment at NERV, and her father committed suicide in grief.

Could you be the one to have written that script format Utena/Eva epic?

Last edited by gorgeousshutin (09-09-2012 11:19:48 AM)

Atropos wrote:
Yes, it's the woman herself. etc-love

I have no IDEA, Ashnod - you've should've self-promote more you Utena landmark epic writer you (and you actually managed to finish your epic, so   from me there)

Then, about that 10 yrs later project you've mentioned to me a while ago . . . is that gonna be an epic too?  Even if you don't think you'd ever finish it, please put out the first chapter(s), please~~  Our fandom is at risk of wilting away from lack of a steady supply of hype-worthy new fics!

Ashnod wrote:
You've actually read Shin Kakumei Evangelion?

Are you kidding?  That was a story I've gone through over and over again since like  2 years ago (as being the impatient reader I am, I would so often skim over/ missed points that I don't notice until my 3rd/4th go through it).  The part where you made (Touga AND Nanami replace Kaworu ) really gave me the fic-readers`chills. 

And not just me, I think everyone who's on EvaGeeks forums (which I'm also on) have likewise read that, and I've yet to see anyone who mentioned it there without hailing it as a classic

Even though much of my Seinen Kakumei canon seem to annoy you, I consider it my honor to have you be a one time-reviewer of that work (am feeling like Shiori already at the thought of how Seinen Kakumei will likely never be as well-known as Shin Kakumei ).

When I wrote Shin Kakumei Evangelion, I held myself to a deadline of a chapter a week

Holy . . . and those are rather lengthy chapters with much going on.  Considering how long it now takes me to struggle through one unbeta-ed Seinen chapter

Posting the rough and seeing what people think might be the only way I actually get it written.

Please . . . !!!!
I myself find fanfics to be much like Akio Cars - they fall into rust if their writers keep it unwritten past their "inspiration" period.  So if you do have something already, please start putting a bit of that out first - other`s reactions to it will often inspire the writer towards having the writing spree needed for longer fics to properly materialize.

(There `s something strange going on with my computer`s ability to type out punctuations.  Will write more once I get it fixed.)

Satyreyes wrote:
I love seeing good fic get its due, but it's a little off-topic here emot-smile  I suggest the compliments thread!

Oops!  Got you and have since moved SKE related stuff over there.