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HOLY SHIT PEOPLE, IT'S NOT BAD ENOUGH WE'RE GETTING AN UTENA EXHIBITION RIGHT NOW

THEY. ARE. MAKING. A. NEW. MUSICAL. NEXT. YEAR. START LOSING YOUR SHIT RIGHT NOW

#1051 | Back to Top11-10-2016 10:22:33 AM

Riri-kins
World's End
From: Cloud Nine
Registered: 09-22-2008
Posts: 2346

Re: Politics

I honestly disliked both presidential candidates so I'm indifferent about who won. Who I'm concerned about is the Vice President elect. He crusaded for defunding Planned Parenthood,didn't he? Now, what some people don't know is that it's not just a place where abortions happen all day long. My mother got her prenatal care there because she was struggling financially when she was pregnant with me. What about poor mothers who want and planned their babies?

On the plus side, I am happy with our new District Attorney. Our old one locked a mentally ill rape victim in jail who did nothing wrong and it was a HUGE local news story.


Proud Saionji and Mikage fangirl
My Utena fanfiction: http://www.fanfiction.net/u/2000115/Riri-kins

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#1052 | Back to Top11-10-2016 01:18:43 PM

Nocturnalux
Qualified Duellist
From: Portugal
Registered: 09-10-2007
Posts: 741

Re: Politics

satyreyes wrote:

Again, just my two cents, and I'm not gainsaying anyone whose reaction to all this is that the other half of America isn't worth talking to.  It's not anyone's obligation to open themselves up to potential abuse, and everyone has the prerogative to get political only with like-minded people.  It's just that I actually believe that love trumps hate.  And I don't know what the antidote to polarization is, but I don't think it's more polarization.

As a foreigner, let me just say that this has made me afraid of interacting with Americans and very likely never to set foot in the States. I know it is foolish, that it is a gut reaction and an unfair one but unfortunately I cannot, presentely, change it. From now on, whenever I meet an American person I will be wondering, did they vote for Trump, and if so, are they of the deplorable kind.
This saddens me deeply, too, it's almost as if some of the angry bitterness of the truly deplorable ones has rubbed off on me by making me so afraid of an entire nation.

DecrescentDaytripper wrote:

Maybe, but to be honest, considering when I left America, one of the last things to happen was to be followed slowly, by a truck full of good old boys in the middle of the night, throwing glass and paper trash at me and yelling racist and homophobic bs at me from my girlfriends' until some dudes unloading their gun rack stopped it and offered me a ride the rest of the way home, I don't want to talk to them.

That is truly, truly horrifying and it made me angry just reading it.

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#1053 | Back to Top11-10-2016 03:26:56 PM

Kita-Ysabell
Covert Diarist
Registered: 11-18-2012
Posts: 818
Website

Re: Politics

I think someone brought up that working-class white voters voting for Trump were voting against their own interest, and thus couldn't be reasoned with, though going back I can't find the actual quote, so I'm sorry if I'm misrepresenting the context.  Thing is, you can't get people to vote for self-interest very much, they vote for values.  As morally bankrupt as Trump is, I can see how this would seem impossible, but yes a lot of people probably voted for him because they believed it was the right thing to do.  They did it altruistically.

Conservatives in America- represented by the Republican party- have done a really good job selling the idea that they have values.  There's social values, which are shared by the shitheads of the nation, but I think those are on the decline these days.  I really want to believe that.  You can rack up some votes there, but you're not going to win an election on an exclusively socially conservative platform these days, not on a national level.

And then there's fiscal conservatism, which is… it's a big lie, really.  It's a myth that the wealthy tell to the not-wealthy to keep them not-wealthy and that they tell to themselves to make themselves feel better about their wealth.  It's something people believe because they really want to, and it goes a little like this: if you're clever and you work hard, you can make it big.  But our economy isn't structured like that.  In the US, work doesn't make money.  Ingenuity only makes money if you are really, really lucky.  No, money makes money.

But if you believe that myth, then having money becomes a sign of virtue.  Those who have money should be rewarded, they should be entrusted with power, and they should be protected from anyone and anything that will try and take them down.  And those who don't?  Well, clearly they didn't work hard enough, and are therefore less deserving.  No point throwing away money on healthcare or services for them.  No fair giving them tax breaks if the wealthy don't get them.  And if you are one of them, it is only right that you accept your place, accept your failings, and keep affirming the myth.

But, because that last is a little too bitter to swallow on its own, there's a caveat: the average working-class American is virtuous.  Maybe not as virtuous as the really rich, but enough so that they should be getting by.  So if they're not, then it's because they're being cheated.  They're being cheated by China and their conspiracy of global warming, by illegal immigrants taking their jobs, (never mind that those jobs don't pay a living wage) by liberal elites, (who are not virtuous, but are clearly doing better, so they must be cheating) by corrupt politicians and their shady e-mails.  The fiscally conservative myth, because it is false, needs a scapegoat.

And that, I think is what people who support and supported Trump believe.  That's why they're willing to vote against self-interest.  Because they believe in an America where hard work is rewarded.

I've got to go to work now, but I might be back later to rant about how the Democrats fail utterly at countering that belief.


"Et in Arcadio ego..."

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#1054 | Back to Top11-10-2016 05:03:49 PM

gpink
Eternal Castellan
Registered: 11-21-2009
Posts: 265

Re: Politics

Education is the only way to overcome these issues. Uneducated people fear the change in the country partly due to no exposure of any kind to other cultures.This is why people who have traveled overseas, immigrated from another country or gone to a College or University with a diverse population seem more capable of understanding (even just in an abstract sense) other cultures. You can't see only the differences between cultures. All humans smile, have celebrations and form families.

Increasing intermarriage and the change in America's racial mix are not going away. One of the reasons that people can be afraid is losing a position of privilege.

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#1055 | Back to Top11-10-2016 06:29:05 PM

pagetheplush
Juri Jeerer
From: your dreams
Registered: 10-30-2015
Posts: 48
Website

Re: Politics

I woke up yesterday morning and had a panic attack the moment I opened my eyes. The past couple days have been absolutely horrifying for not just me, but most of my friends too because most of us fall somewhere along the lgbt+ spectrum and we are terrified of losing our rights and of our lives possibly getting a lot more unsafe. (and that is just one issue, I could go on and on about all the other forms of bigotry and hate looming over us but this one was the most talked about at the time.) The only good thing that has really come out of this is that we're all talking to each other more, and we've been coming together to comfort each other and stand up for what is right. The uncertainty of what could happen from here is petrifying, but being together with other people who care and keep each other safe has given me some hope.


🌹Let's become like rose petals, blowing free!🌹

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#1056 | Back to Top11-12-2016 01:35:28 AM

Giovanna
Ends of the Forum
From: Edmonton, AB
Registered: 10-12-2006
Posts: 8731
Website

Re: Politics

Nocturnalux wrote:

As a foreigner, let me just say that this has made me afraid of interacting with Americans and very likely never to set foot in the States.

I want, as an American, to be able to say 'NO WAI YOU'RE ALL WRONG IT'S AMAZING HERE.' I want to say that, and sometimes, in some places, I believe it to be true. I'm not as well traveled as I'd like to be, but there is nowhere I've ever been that felt as much home to me as NYC. It's everything I understand to be what America is about, for better and worse, and is also not at all what anyone from the midwest would describe as being what America is about. That's part of the problem, it's such a huge geographical space with so many insanely different cultures that often don't speak to each other, that you can be a NY American and a Texas American and see eye to eye on literally nothing whatsoever.

Unfortunately, I do see where you're coming from. There's a long list of places in the world I dearly want to go, but am afraid to, either because they're so war torn, or because two women without a male chaperone would attract very bad attention.

This is going to be a dark period in our history. Full stop. We're going to be forced to face a lot of things festering in our culture. We're about to lance a boil, and it's yet to be seen whether that results in healing, or sepsis. I have faith, though. And even if I want to sneer and ignore them, I'm willing to listen to the people who felt so cornered they'd vote for a tangerine garbage fire like Trump. If it turns out that they're really just racist assholes, and it's not fueled by a deeper loss of identity or sense of opportunity, then fuck 'em. But at this point, we can't afford to write them off out of hand. They vote.

And we didn't.


Also, do thou wear thine suits and cuffs, be thee male or no, for such attire doth please my girl parts. - Gios 3:15
Chiefest of Calamities

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#1057 | Back to Top11-12-2016 05:08:18 PM

Hinotori
The Notable Death Mantis
From: Soviet Ohiostan
Registered: 10-23-2006
Posts: 1333

Re: Politics

I keep frickin' logging into this forum to revisit the 2008 election thread. Simpler times.  I completely forgot that there is a good 8 pages of that dedicated to the implications of abolishing the electoral college.

This is all a disaster. I think one of the NeverTrumpers like Lindsey Graham needs to sit down small town America and explain why legislature doesn't really have the power to bring back the steel mills an coal mines. My family has already blocked me on facebook or I'd do it.

Last edited by Hinotori (11-12-2016 05:10:10 PM)


Hinotori made this post, and then went back and changed it later. Such is life.


It is amazing what you can accomplish if you do not care who gets the credit." - Harry Truman

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#1058 | Back to Top11-24-2016 12:44:55 PM

malna
Caretaker
From: Poland
Registered: 10-03-2011
Posts: 209

Re: Politics

European Parliament Votes to Suspend Talks With Turkey on E.U. Membership


And what better day to cut Turkey's throat than Thanksgiving!
I'm not taking stand on whether or not this is a good call. It's probably the only one possible in current circumstances. It is what it is.


a lot of hope in one man tent

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#1059 | Back to Top12-02-2016 09:43:53 AM

SexingTouga24/7/365
is on a BOAT!
Registered: 12-10-2006
Posts: 2267

Re: Politics

I am so disheartened by the US presidential election and really need to get on filling out that refugee paperwork to move to Canada. My tax money has paid for a whole lot of gross and horrible things: widespread systematic racism, sexism, and international grand scale xenophobia; which I hate for a number of personal reasons, but lazily dealt with due to having to as an US citizen. But the impact of wide spread Nazism and having to live under it is just, it's sort of the last straw. As a a single  minority female person, history has indicated that this is not going to go well for me. Looking at the increase in hate crimes after Brexit https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 … gures-show and after the US election https://www.globalcitizen.org/en/conten … lc-report/.
     It's not that I don't somewhat understand/agree with the individuals disagreed with Hillary's politics and hated her/them, or in some part wanted to just supply the US political arena with the clown/s it somewhat deserves. I mean it's been such an circus/ sideshow and somewhat ineffective, depending on your position in society for so many years... one might figure that well I have to continue paying for this, BS so it should be somewhat amusing. It's been over a month and this is as calm and so called polite, as I can mange to comment on the situation. My deep and abiding core of schadenfreude, goes ok if this is what happens fine just let me get out of the the way and leave you to it. After all it can be amusing to watch sideshows/bonfires from a distance.
    I looked over some of the comments up thread and am commending everyone on their calm and fair points regarding Ringleader Trump. But it's depressing that this conversation, in the USA has to keep being had, and fought for, in regard to rights and individuals having an inherent right to getting treated fairly/respectfully by federal and state governments (due to funding them). I understand that it's a complex issue due to human beings personal basis and perception, that their will always be injustices somewhere, somehow. It's exhausting to see so little grand scale progress with a greater portion and sections of society respecting minorities. Sorry that this is long and rant filled.

Last edited by SexingTouga24/7/365 (12-02-2016 09:46:03 AM)


"If all the world is a stage and all the people players"...then I demand a less shitty part or the ability to get off of the stage. Slowly my sanity slides, slipping, swirling, spiraling...Save Me I need Sleep...Shattering Soon. school-devil "RukaxTouga equals the Fourth of July" MY patriotic celebration...FUCK ME TOUGA AND RUKA NOW!! etc-wankgirl etc-wankdude

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#1060 | Back to Top12-02-2016 02:27:45 PM

Riri-kins
World's End
From: Cloud Nine
Registered: 09-22-2008
Posts: 2346

Re: Politics

Let me start by saying I'm mostly liberal and am no fan of the President-Elect, but I don't think this is the end of the country.

We survived President Grant, Hoover, and Dubya. We'll survive Trump somehow. If it's any consolation I doubt that wall he promised will get built. Good luck getting Congress to approve such a silly thing (or anything at all for that matter.)


Proud Saionji and Mikage fangirl
My Utena fanfiction: http://www.fanfiction.net/u/2000115/Riri-kins

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#1061 | Back to Top12-02-2016 03:43:02 PM

Kita-Ysabell
Covert Diarist
Registered: 11-18-2012
Posts: 818
Website

Re: Politics

I mean, we do have a Republican House and Senate, so it's not like that'll be as much of an obstruction to Trump's shitty conservative policies as the divided, often right-leaning congressional bodies that Obama's had to deal with.  But on the other hand, a lot of Trump's proposals just… aren't terribly possible.  Like the wall.  That… you're gonna need a bigger budget for that, buddy.

And yes, the shitheads of the nation have taken this as a vote of confidence, and are feeling freer to act out than they have beforehand.  And, as ISIS has proved, stopping a handful of lone actors with an intent to harm is really hard, and inciting them to action, as such a vote of confidence has done, is easy.  That's shitty and I won't pretend it's not.

And I also won't pretend that living in a very liberal part of a very liberal state isn't a huge privilege.  A lot of the protections that Trump plans on eroding for the country are already enforced on a local level, here, and there's one or two that might be challenged by the national government, (such as the sanctuary city status for immigrants) but mostly there's a whole lot that's not going to change.  We'll still have legalized abortion, and anti-discrimination laws, and marriage equality.

So when I say that I'm committed to staying, to riding this out, and that this too will pass, I know that in ways, I'm doing that from a position of strength.  There are definitely reasons that this will be more survivable for me than it might be for others.  To which I also say: hey, it's way easier to move to Washington than it is to move to Canada.

Because one reason I'm not considering leaving the country is that… the lucky can leave.  Others can't.  And those who leave surrender the ability to influence incoming US policy.  It's time, I think, for those who know better to start doing better, to build support networks, to craft political infrastructure, and to take part in opposition to and criticism of wrong and dangerous legislation.  Not to mince words, but Trump really has shown tendencies that are downright fascist, and barring a miracle in the electoral college (worth a try but I don't hold much hope) his first term as president will define what the American public will be willing to go along with.

What it comes down to is, if worst comes to worst, I can do more here.  And if it doesn't… well, that's all right then, isn't it?


"Et in Arcadio ego..."

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#1062 | Back to Top12-04-2016 04:59:03 PM

Decrescent Daytripper
Best Disney Princess
Registered: 04-09-2007
Posts: 2788

Re: Politics

Victory at Standing Rock! My uncle and cousin were just driving a van-load of elders up there yesterday, so I'm relieved for them, too, but overall, just woo! Something.


My Brain is the Wakaba and Shiori Funtime Hour. With limited commercial interruption.

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#1063 | Back to Top12-06-2016 07:23:27 PM

Dreaded Claymore
Rose Bride
From: Sacramento, California
Registered: 01-28-2014
Posts: 116

Re: Politics

I have sworn by the Gods to uphold and defend the Constitution of the United States, and to bear true faith and allegiance to the same. Significantly, I have also sworn to obey the orders of the President of the United States. Goddess help me.

Edit: corrected spelling of the name of the country

Last edited by Dreaded Claymore (12-13-2016 07:18:31 AM)

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#1064 | Back to Top12-12-2016 08:11:03 PM

SexingTouga24/7/365
is on a BOAT!
Registered: 12-10-2006
Posts: 2267

Re: Politics

Wishing you all the best with serving over the next few years and dealing with that possible conflict of interest...I remember considering similar line of thought/issue once when I was younger, and some US branch was calling and attempting to recruit me. After wondering how desperate they were due to my total insatiability for any military service due to being inactive, fat, and questioning.


"If all the world is a stage and all the people players"...then I demand a less shitty part or the ability to get off of the stage. Slowly my sanity slides, slipping, swirling, spiraling...Save Me I need Sleep...Shattering Soon. school-devil "RukaxTouga equals the Fourth of July" MY patriotic celebration...FUCK ME TOUGA AND RUKA NOW!! etc-wankgirl etc-wankdude

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#1065 | Back to Top12-25-2016 09:33:49 PM

Razara
Marionette Mistress
From: Wuzzy Happy Akio Town (What?)
Registered: 10-17-2006
Posts: 4693

Re: Politics

Current American politics: Fuck my life! emot-gonk

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#1066 | Back to Top01-05-2017 09:05:34 PM

Razara
Marionette Mistress
From: Wuzzy Happy Akio Town (What?)
Registered: 10-17-2006
Posts: 4693

Re: Politics

After reading this thread again, I see that satyreyes feels the same way that I do about this election. When I first started posting here, my understanding of politics was pretty awful, but to this day I always think of satyreyes as the voice of reason reason when it comes to politics. As long as thoughtful people like satyreyes exist, the future can't be as bad as I fear.

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#1067 | Back to Top01-29-2017 07:46:21 AM

malna
Caretaker
From: Poland
Registered: 10-03-2011
Posts: 209

Re: Politics

Something optimistic amidst flood of pessimism. Consequence of Brexit:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C3PwlTcWIAEP-Tu.jpg:large

Cool. General tendency is good. Also, nice to see my country still being the most EUroenthusiastic within the EU.
More than that, calls for one foreign policy and army in the EU are finally being heard and it is getting real, winning support of prominent politicians in member countries. I'm afraid to have hope but yeah... looks like there is real chance for progress there.

Last edited by malna (01-29-2017 08:03:43 AM)


a lot of hope in one man tent

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#1068 | Back to Top02-16-2017 09:18:59 PM

Yasha
Bitch Queen
From: Edmonton, AB, Canada
Registered: 10-15-2006
Posts: 6018
Website

Re: Politics

I'm not going to pretend to have a super-informed opinion here, but I believe it is the internet's right and duty to troll Trump into a mental breakdown. Watching the tides of white male supremacy and nazi sympathizing build on stormfront, 4chan, and return of kings, seeing how those things coalesced into support for Trump, it can get a bit disheartening. But as someone with a deep interest in internet subcultures and practices, I have noticed a tendency for them to tear down the people they built up. I very much agree with the trends people are starting, like bash the fash (the saying) and President Bannon. Punching nazis who are just talking is not a good thing. Educating them and debating them is best. But damn, the punching is satisfying.

I'm going to make a prediction: If Canada keeps doing things that are counter to the opinions held by the current US political power, at some point Trump will try to paint us as enemies or dangerous or something along those lines. When I first predicted this to Gio, I had said it would happen within three months. I'm not sure about that timeline anymore because goddamn, Trudeau is an awesome fucking diplomat. I'm actually really proud to have him as a representative of my country. He embodies a lot of what I value about Canada. So... I'll say six months. Trudeau might forestall it. But it's fucking coming, for sure.

Also... I would just like to remind everyone that bad government means great comedy shows and awesome punk rock. SNL is already killing it. This might be scary, but it's also fucking funny, and don't forget it.


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#1069 | Back to Top02-17-2017 08:04:50 PM

SaigonAlice
Mikage Mistruster
Registered: 09-13-2016
Posts: 66

Re: Politics

Yasha wrote:

Punching nazis who are just talking is not a good thing. Educating them and debating them is best. But damn, the punching is satisfying.

Yeah, I know I'm being a huge nitpick but I'm going to say it anyway - I don't really know about that point.

The fact of the matter is these Nazis, i.e. mostly young and entitled White men, cannot and simply will not properly visualise consequences to their actions.  I see the punch as something symbolic, as a very tangible consequence for espousing horrific violence upon violence. Remember, Richard is the guy who has made essays for a 'peaceful' genocide of Black Americans.

But t was a good punch wasn't it? emot-rofl

Last edited by SaigonAlice (02-17-2017 08:05:13 PM)


Thân em như quả mít trên cây,
Vỏ nó sù sì, múi nó dày.
Quân tử có yêu thì đóng cọc,
Xin đừng mân mó nhựa ra tay. - Hồ Xuân Hương

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#1070 | Back to Top02-17-2017 11:36:36 PM

Yasha
Bitch Queen
From: Edmonton, AB, Canada
Registered: 10-15-2006
Posts: 6018
Website

Re: Politics

The point of educating and debating is not just to try and sway the person you're talking to, which has a fairly limited chance of success anyway, but also to have a chance at making your points to everyone else, and possibly helping them to understand why white supremacy is a bullshit ideology for losers who have nothing else to be proud of.


However... macklemore hair frog man is very punchable. I can understand if the dude meant to debate and was just overcome by his punchability. Cannot say I wouldn't do the same.


Hat Mafia Member: Ratchedface
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#1071 | Back to Top02-18-2017 02:35:10 AM

SaigonAlice
Mikage Mistruster
Registered: 09-13-2016
Posts: 66

Re: Politics

Yasha wrote:

The point of educating and debating is not just to try and sway the person you're talking to, which has a fairly limited chance of success anyway, but also to have a chance at making your points to everyone else, and possibly helping them to understand why white supremacy is a bullshit ideology for losers who have nothing else to be proud of.

I can understand that. We do need all the allies we can get. But I think we should consider who are usually at the forefront of these debates, namely Jewish and Black people. I mean, there's only so much dehumanising rhetoric you can take before you finally...snap. It's not exactly a fair discussion for Jewish or Black educators to have to begin with.

Also that was a pretty funny edit! Personally I prefer the gamecube edit:


Thân em như quả mít trên cây,
Vỏ nó sù sì, múi nó dày.
Quân tử có yêu thì đóng cọc,
Xin đừng mân mó nhựa ra tay. - Hồ Xuân Hương

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#1072 | Back to Top02-18-2017 03:15:34 AM

Giovanna
Ends of the Forum
From: Edmonton, AB
Registered: 10-12-2006
Posts: 8731
Website

Re: Politics

You guys can't do this to me, I'm at work and can't watch videos. emot-gonk

I know it's terrible and I don't condone that kind of uh...political activity. But it is very satisfying. I forced myself through that whole speech he made to his little 'think tank' in Washington and it was actually horrifying to listen to.


Also, do thou wear thine suits and cuffs, be thee male or no, for such attire doth please my girl parts. - Gios 3:15
Chiefest of Calamities

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#1073 | Back to Top02-18-2017 04:59:01 AM

Yasha
Bitch Queen
From: Edmonton, AB, Canada
Registered: 10-15-2006
Posts: 6018
Website

Re: Politics

Oh, ugh. I can only imagine what he said.

Maybe I should make that thread about Internet affecting politics. Like, that topic specifically is super interesting to me and it's sort of creeping into a bunch of threads emot-redface


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#1074 | Back to Top02-18-2017 07:55:47 AM

malna
Caretaker
From: Poland
Registered: 10-03-2011
Posts: 209

Re: Politics

Yasha wrote:

Maybe I should make that thread about Internet affecting politics. Like, that topic specifically is super interesting to me and it's sort of creeping into a bunch of threads emot-redface

It is interesting and consequential.
I sometimes think it to be Putin's dark humor that through various means (an onslaught of Kremlin payed trolls in comments sections, social media, chats and forums, financial support for nationalist parties in EU countries, hacking and leaking things, etc) he affects public opinion in western countries a whole lot and uses democracy to dismantle democracy. It's Touga-level cynical but I'll grant him it's clever and does deliver a point.

But that's not what I was going to write about here today. Just wanted to say that the level of hate directed towards refugees whenever there's even a tiny possibility of letting any of them in my country is horrible. I understand fear, I really do. With all these terrorist attacks just outside our western border we'd have to be mad not to be afraid. Still, the utter refusal to even consider how to help this people, the unanimous bashing of anyone who even tries to help - this is horrible and shameful. And it's not all just out of fear; it's pure hatred for hatred's sake. I'm so fed up with it and I'd love to just not think about it but it's ceaselessly pouring out of the Polish internet, from streets and politicians alike.


a lot of hope in one man tent

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#1075 | Back to Top02-20-2017 02:22:39 AM

Giovanna
Ends of the Forum
From: Edmonton, AB
Registered: 10-12-2006
Posts: 8731
Website

Re: Politics

Using democracy against itself is definitely cynicism on what I understand to be a classic Russian level. But if your country has been a blur of abuse, propaganda, and total socioeconomic immobility, what mentality can you really have? There's a long documented history of how much BS Russians can take before they flip the desk, but it's kind of horrifying how much that is.

malna, do you feel like the hatred for its own sake is truly driven by fear, or is the sentiment more protectionist than concern for life? The US, when its head is only partly up its own ass, likes to sell that kind of fear in Europe being the unfortunate result of a country that was founded on a small number of cultural groups being terrified of losing that identity. AMERICA of course doesn't have this problem because it is a nation of immigrants! Although someone should really remind them of that. The US has always stood on its high horse about how great and multicultural it is, while behind the scenes being just as bad, or worse. It's only now that that xenophobic undercurrent is really out there for the world to see. I definitely feel like there's more justification in the fear for you guys. We have an extraordinary amount of control over who comes and goes, with no land access to the 'source' of the problem, and it's hard to really grasp how truly deeply these fears can be felt somewhere where the 'threat' frankly is more real.

I try to give people that are afraid the benefit of the doubt. If I believed, truly, that not bringing in refugees would solve the problem on a global scale, then I too would probably lock the door on them. But it doesn't work that way, and actually you get the opposite problem. You may have one fewer terrorist attack in your generation by refusing to help these people, but the next generation is going to be full of radicalized victims of your policy, with hatred burning up from years of thinking of you as an enemy and not as a friend. America has a long history of making a god damn mess in the ME, and a lot of this mess is frankly our fault, or at least in part. I honestly don't know as much about the European role in things, but that I'm aware it's not quite black ops CIA puppet government crap like we do. I feel like this is a turning point in Europe, and how this crisis is dealt with is going to define the problems or progress our grandchildren will have to deal with.

I know you want to not think about it. But remember, this is not normal. Don't let the bombardment slowly normalize views you already know are wrong. Bullshit fatigue is real, and it's the black plague of our generation.


Also, do thou wear thine suits and cuffs, be thee male or no, for such attire doth please my girl parts. - Gios 3:15
Chiefest of Calamities

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