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Gougai! Gougai!

HOLY SHIT PEOPLE, IT'S NOT BAD ENOUGH WE'RE GETTING AN UTENA EXHIBITION RIGHT NOW

THEY. ARE. MAKING. A. NEW. MUSICAL. NEXT. YEAR. START LOSING YOUR SHIT RIGHT NOW

#1 | Back to Top06-11-2007 01:00:54 AM

Persephone
Memorial Hollerer
From: Edge of the Light
Registered: 01-31-2007
Posts: 687
Website

UtenaxMiki

I'm not sure if anyone has made a thread about this yet. If they have, feel free to delete.

I'm not a crazy deviant from original script relationships, but I really did and still do like the idea of Miki's crush on Utena.
I believe I read a Doujin(includes IFD-ish material) of it one time, and also the original manga crush.

[analyze]I really feel Utena and Miki represent the true middle school crush, conceptually. Utena may have not had as strong a feeling about love as Miki did, but when Kozue came into the picture, it became obsolete. Which makes me wonder what is so intimidating about Kozue which makes Miki back down, and hide himself from others?
I really think Miki liked Utena because she represented all that was good in his idea of a woman, and at one point, Kozue may have been as such; but the years of black jealousy for Miki's fanclub, closed her up and made her want only him. When we think about it, who's happiness was she really out to satisfy? Her's of Miki's.
I think personally, the feeling was deeply selfish, perhaps abuse of any kind was bestowed upon her by a close relative and she was never able to reach a certain maturity point, which would allow her to disconnect the cord from her brother. Love is not about satisfying yourself, but about making others happy. She was only holding Miki back from becoming the man he deserved to be...[/analyze][pause to rant]AUGH I'M OFF ON A DIFFERENT SUBJECT!!!!!!!!![/pause]


[analyze]Back to Utena and Miki,
I really think Miki wanted to be as Utena in a way, so he could become strong and stand up for himself, since Utena seemed a representation of nobility and strength.
Miki needed those abiding qualities to have some great balls, since apparently his niceness wasn't meriting him much on the part of having honorable traits. Who knew what was plaguing Miki? Not me. I have a lot of different ideas about the subject, but I am too lazy to write about it.  The point is, I believe Utena really showed Miki, what it means to fight for what your believe in. Which is why Miki more admired her than anything else, which can develop into feelings (think of teacher/student relations). [/analyze]

I'd love for you guys to add your points.


It's just time to be
sammy to the rasoodock.
And close up the business
of heart-related matters.

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#2 | Back to Top06-13-2007 11:50:56 PM

Rae
Black Rosarian
Registered: 01-10-2007
Posts: 390

Re: UtenaxMiki

I really do like this couple too. People tend to overlook this because the manga just not as popular. For me though, the manga was my first ever exposure to Utena back when I was thirteen years old (which was six years ago). Looking at discussions of the pairing brings back memories when I was a huge fan of the two.

Persephone wrote:

Who knew what was plaguing Miki? Not me. I have a lot of different ideas about the subject, but I am too lazy to write about it.

According to Volume 4, each duelist (for the exception of Touga and Utena) had a specific weakness that prevented him/her from continuing up the castle:

Saionji: Assumption
Juri: Obstinacy
Miki: Immaturity

Miki's approach to things were always sudden and rash. Always, well, childlike in a sense. These all involved: the breaking into Touga's dorm, the kiss, and the refusal to dual. You are absolutely right that Utena taught him to fight for himself. What Miki seemed ro realize is that he has to grow up. It was that desire to mature that seemed to drive him on. The irony of it all was that he could never find the right, mature method to think things through. That is what made him fail at the end. Along with assumption and obstinacy, one cannot be at the state of adulthood because these factors him/her back. That's my idea, anyway so ... it might be wrong. emot-redface

Why Chiho Saito added this couple is still a mystery to me. It's quite a contrast compared to the anime version where Miki is in love with Anthy instead. Perhaps it was simply for the sake of the typical shoujo audience? Dang, it's hard to analyze the manga since the plot is just so simpleemot-rolleyes

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#3 | Back to Top06-14-2007 11:52:40 AM

brian
Atlantean Singer
Registered: 10-22-2006
Posts: 588

Re: UtenaxMiki

Rae wrote:

According to Volume 4, each duelist (for the exception of Touga and Utena) had a specific weakness that prevented him/her from continuing up the castle:

Saionji: Assumption
Juri: Obstinacy
Miki: Immaturity

I think it's not that they did not have weaknesses but that they did not let their weaknesses imprison them. Therefore we never found out the names of their coffins. I've always wondered what the names on their unused coffins might have been.

Rae wrote:

Why Chiho Saito added this couple is still a mystery to me. It's quite a contrast compared to the anime version where Miki is in love with Anthy instead.

Probably also just space considerations. Either way it is something to incite Kozue.

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#4 | Back to Top06-15-2007 11:22:31 PM

Persephone
Memorial Hollerer
From: Edge of the Light
Registered: 01-31-2007
Posts: 687
Website

Re: UtenaxMiki

It was fresh, how many childlike loves do you see in Utena? (not in immature cases like nanamixtouga, which borders on obsession)
I feel CS wanted to have the entire spectrum of human connection, most relationships are deep and developed, and it was nice to see a brief crush between two characters.
I also feel this small crush, showed us just a bit of miki's personality and how he deals with the people around him.


It's just time to be
sammy to the rasoodock.
And close up the business
of heart-related matters.

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#5 | Back to Top06-20-2007 10:35:29 AM

Giovanna
Ends of the Forum
From: Edmonton, AB
Registered: 10-12-2006
Posts: 8731
Website

Re: UtenaxMiki

Persephone wrote:

Miki needed those abiding qualities to have some great balls, since apparently his niceness wasn't meriting him much on the part of having honorable traits. Who knew what was plaguing Miki?

You know, I don't remember the manga too well, it's been a while, but that seems to me a repeated theme with him, that he's kinda...well...a wimp. In both the manga and the series. Both harp so much on the idea of being a good person, and Miki is at least clearly a nice one, but he doesn't seem to be 'rewarded' for it the same way Utena is. It's as if a point's being made to state that it's not enough, you've gotta have the balls.


Also, do thou wear thine suits and cuffs, be thee male or no, for such attire doth please my girl parts. - Gios 3:15
Chiefest of Calamities

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#6 | Back to Top06-20-2007 04:50:04 PM

Scortia
Rose Bride
From: Louisiana
Registered: 12-23-2006
Posts: 116

Re: UtenaxMiki

...it doesn't say much for a guy when Tenjo Utena has more balls than you do. emot-tongue

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#7 | Back to Top06-20-2007 08:54:25 PM

Stormcrow
Magical Flying Moron
From: Los Angeles
Registered: 04-24-2007
Posts: 5971
Website

Re: UtenaxMiki

That's a little unfair. After all, Utena has balls of solid brass!


"The devil want me as is, but god he want more."
-Truck North
Honorary Hat Mafia Member

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#8 | Back to Top06-20-2007 08:58:11 PM

Razara
Marionette Mistress
From: Wuzzy Happy Akio Town (What?)
Registered: 10-17-2006
Posts: 4694

Re: UtenaxMiki

Even his little sister has more balls than him.

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#9 | Back to Top06-21-2007 10:50:36 AM

Coco Melancholy
Framed Landscaper
Registered: 06-04-2007
Posts: 415

Re: UtenaxMiki

What does that say about me when I probably have less balls than Miki emot-gonk

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#10 | Back to Top06-21-2007 07:00:14 PM

Persephone
Memorial Hollerer
From: Edge of the Light
Registered: 01-31-2007
Posts: 687
Website

Re: UtenaxMiki

Coco Melancholy wrote:

What does that say about me when I probably have less balls than Miki emot-gonk

I say you hold yourself in low esteem.


It's just time to be
sammy to the rasoodock.
And close up the business
of heart-related matters.

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#11 | Back to Top06-21-2007 07:05:20 PM

Tamago
God of Comedy
From: Minami Goushuu
Registered: 10-17-2006
Posts: 14280
Website

Re: UtenaxMiki

Coco Melancholy wrote:

What does that say about me when I probably have less balls than Miki emot-gonk

If you can't develop a bigger set of balls, try growing a bigger set of overies instead, sure no one but your X-ray technician will see them but you will know you got them where it counyts (I hope you understand the metaphors Im using here)

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#12 | Back to Top06-22-2007 01:23:08 AM

Coco Melancholy
Framed Landscaper
Registered: 06-04-2007
Posts: 415

Re: UtenaxMiki

Everyones held back and stunted anyway, Miki's simply more receptive than active, and Juri's not active where it counts, and I wouldn't say Saionji has anymore balls than Miki.......projecting a past relationship onto Anthy the same way Miki does......but then proceeding to beat her about. And how ballsy is moping around like a baby for a whole series Touga. Even Akio remaining trapped in he's little coffin even to the end would be considered to have less balls than Utena. Its what makes Utena the main character and the one to bring the revolution. Shes just got more balls than everybody O.o.

Though I wouldn't say Miki's feminine and childlike qualities make him a wimp. I don't remember him showing much cowardice during the series like sacraficing others to save he's own skin or expecting others to do things for him or giving up without trying.......stuff like that. Not many of the characters are given the oppotunity to grow, though when Miki is, he does try.

And anyway. Anybody who can endure Kozue and befriend Juri has got to have some balls somewhere.


Persephone wrote:

I say you hold yourself in low esteem.

emot-aaa oh my gaud wha-oh, no wait, okay fair enough that true. emot-keke

Tamago wrote:

If you can't develop a bigger set of balls, try growing a bigger set of overies instead, sure no one but your X-ray technician will see them but you will know you got them where it counyts (I hope you understand the metaphors Im using here)

I think I do. Anyway it sounds amusing and wise so I'll take it away and ponder.

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#13 | Back to Top02-28-2013 12:33:57 AM

RhythmFusion
Rose Smilee
Registered: 03-18-2010
Posts: 131

Re: UtenaxMiki

Coco Melancholy wrote:

Anybody who can endure Kozue and befriend Juri has got to have some balls somewhere.

Indeed.emot-keke


"But screw your courage to the sticking place, and we'll not fail." ~ Lady Macbeth; Macbeth - Act One, Scene 7
"Crying is such hypocrisy. How can happiness cause the same reaction as sadness? Does pleasure share the same edge of the blade of life as pain?" - What His Crimson Eyes Believe in: Ch. 2

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