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HOLY SHIT PEOPLE, IT'S NOT BAD ENOUGH WE'RE GETTING AN UTENA EXHIBITION RIGHT NOW

THEY. ARE. MAKING. A. NEW. MUSICAL. NEXT. YEAR. START LOSING YOUR SHIT RIGHT NOW

#1 | Back to Top05-19-2009 09:30:49 PM

The_A_Man
Someday Shiner
From: Canada
Registered: 02-22-2009
Posts: 9107
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Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

OK, this is a new theory that just came to me awhile ago. With a bit of brainstorming, I was able to fit this all together.

Well my theory is that Mikage is actually Utena's father. This alone sounds questionable. If Mikage were the father, then who's the mother. Then I came up with the perfect candidate, Tokiko. Remember how when Mikage looks at Utena, he sees Tokiko. Before I wondered why, but if the idea of her being her mother is correct, then this would explain it. It would also explain why Utena resembles Mikage as well.

Here's the story I came up with that makes this theory possible. Back when Nemuro was working towards revolution, it was obvious that he had feelings for Tokiko. What if before he set the fire, he slept with Tokiko and got her pregnant. If this is true, then it explains why he got so upset when Akio was necking with her and set the fire. Then Tokiko got upset after he set the fire that she left him.

But then you're probably wondering about the story about Utena's parents being dead. Well I figured Mikage did actually died all those years ago, but I know Tokiko didn't. Then I thought that it was possible she was too ashamed and didn't want to be reminded of Mikage that she set her baby (Utena) up for adoption. The adopted parents then died some years later.

Well that's my theory. Anyone want to add on or argue this? Or agree or disagree? Fell free to discuss this.

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#2 | Back to Top05-20-2009 10:33:07 AM

Giovanna
Ends of the Forum
From: Edmonton, AB
Registered: 10-12-2006
Posts: 8728
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Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

Oh, I like. emot-dance

It explains the way Mikage, who doesn't seem to know Utena at all, so vividly associates her with Tokiko. Easy enough to do but that's totally fuel on the fire. (har har.) Also talk about loading on the incest. No, Akio's not her father but man.

While I suspect more hints would be given if it were true, this is definitely an interesting way to run with things, and really, I could see it fitting Mikage's character rather well to sacrifice his own daughter to his ends. Mikage has the coldness of calculation. (As opposed to say the coldness of Akio or Touga's self-interest, or Juri's self-centeredness.)
school-sherlock


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#3 | Back to Top05-20-2009 11:02:43 AM

Nanami's Rose Groom
Rose Assignee
From: Czluchow, Northern Poland
Registered: 04-07-2007
Posts: 1717
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Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

Hey, that theory would solve the fact that in the manga, Utena's aunt, Yurika, looks really much like Mikage... and even smiles in the same , creepy way...


"Get back to the surface, where the sunlight is so dazzling"

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#4 | Back to Top05-20-2009 12:49:13 PM

hollow_rose
Egghead
From: Ohio
Registered: 10-26-2008
Posts: 1074

Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

Yeah I had a theory similar to this. Only in mine, Tokiko was the victor of some past set of duels and when Anthy ran her through in the duel of Revolution (as she did Utena) some small fragment of Dios' soul imbedded itself in the child in Tokiko's womb. Hence why Utena has the connection with Dios.


20 threads dead so far.

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#5 | Back to Top05-20-2009 01:49:37 PM

Hedgehogey
Framed Landscaper
Registered: 01-30-2008
Posts: 430

Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

Which would make Utena an immaculate conception?

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#6 | Back to Top05-20-2009 01:53:13 PM

hollow_rose
Egghead
From: Ohio
Registered: 10-26-2008
Posts: 1074

Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

Hedgehogey wrote:

Which would make Utena an immaculate conception?

Not....exactly. Utena is physically the daughter of Mikage and Tokiko. But her soul is in part, Dios', which is why she has that strange connection with him.


20 threads dead so far.

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#7 | Back to Top05-20-2009 02:10:45 PM

Nanami's Rose Groom
Rose Assignee
From: Czluchow, Northern Poland
Registered: 04-07-2007
Posts: 1717
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Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

Now, that I'm thinking of it... Mikage might be a male, fallen counterpart of Utena... something like...how would Utena end if she was male, and if she fell for Akio's tricks.
Mikage and Utena have not only physical appearance in common, but their purpose to duel is very similar. They both fight for something which turns out to be an illusion created and supported by Akio, for his own needs. They both have Anthy (although Mikage sees her as Mamiya). Even he admits during his duel that in the end, he and Utena are the same. These words kind of support the theory, that in Nemuro's timeline HE had the opportunity to become the Victor, if only he hadn't fall for Akio's plan...


"Get back to the surface, where the sunlight is so dazzling"

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#8 | Back to Top05-20-2009 08:29:55 PM

satyreyes
no, definitely no cons
From: New Orleans, Louisiana
Registered: 10-16-2006
Posts: 10328
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Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

Two problems.  First, it's not obvious to me that Nemuro was attracted to Tokiko, though she seemed attracted to him; Mamiya seemed more Nemuro's type.  Second, Utena's parents are dead and in coffins, while Tokiko is alive as of episode 22.  (We know nothing about Nemuro's death, oddly enough.  He could even still be alive somewhere and have left behind Mikage as a sort of vestige of his insanity.)

Which doesn't mean they aren't related, but if Utena is Nemuro's daughter I don't think it can be by Tokiko, and I can't think of any other women he could have slept with.

Edit: I'm so sorry, I must not have read your post all the way through and didn't see you've already addressed this.  Wow, Utena an adoptee?  I guess it's possible, but... I think there would have to be some hint somewhere.

Last edited by satyreyes (05-20-2009 08:35:15 PM)

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#9 | Back to Top05-20-2009 08:57:51 PM

SexingTouga24/7/365
is on a BOAT!
Registered: 12-10-2006
Posts: 2267

Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

Wow that would be an hell of a family reunion if true...nice idea about the adoption angle. Does Utena talk about who raised her at all?


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#10 | Back to Top05-20-2009 09:03:27 PM

Raven Nightshade
Someday Shiner
From: Louisiana
Registered: 12-17-2006
Posts: 2916

Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

I'd actually had a similar theory, but it was movie-Utena with non-existent movie-Mikage and movie-Tokiko as her parents. It didn't seem like much of a stretch because anime-Tokiko's hair looks exactly like movie-Utena's.

I feel like Ikuhara spent so much effort making sure that major and semi-major characters had individual hair colors that giving 2 seemingly unrelated characters the exact same hair color has to have some meaning behind it. Even Miki and Kozue's hair isn't the same shade of blue.


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It's so far and out of sight.
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#11 | Back to Top05-20-2009 09:48:43 PM

Soukougnan
Black Rosarian
From: home. sort of.
Registered: 01-02-2009
Posts: 373

Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

i've always wondered about this myself, but never actually sat down to think about it. compelling arguments you have there, and the way that Ikuhara works, just like raven said, i wouldn't at all be surprised.


what-- where did i go?

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#12 | Back to Top05-21-2009 12:19:58 PM

Anthiena
Egghead
From: ...the space between your ears
Registered: 10-21-2006
Posts: 1107

Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

I requested a sketch of Mikage and Yurika for just that purpose. They look astonishingly alike. Mikage being Utena's uncle would make sense as well.


I stopped seeking to be sought after. That wasn't being true to myself.
I want to become someone who can exercise power. I want to become a prince. - Ikuni

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#13 | Back to Top05-22-2009 10:30:44 PM

Undead Princess
Saionji Slapper
From: South Florida
Registered: 11-01-2006
Posts: 28
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Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

Nanami's Rose Groom wrote:

Now, that I'm thinking of it... Mikage might be a male, fallen counterpart of Utena... something like...how would Utena end if she was male, and if she fell for Akio's tricks.

That's how I always felt- he was bizzaro-Utena to me. I mean, I knew that him having an Indian side-kick was no coincidence (although I never thought it'd be Anthy in disguise emot-aaa ) but I always felt Mikage was a part of Utena's potential as a person.
Even though Mikage compares Utena to Tokiko, they're the similar ones. Utena at that point isn't obsessed with Anthy, but she is obsessed with Dios which later makes her rethink her life, much as Mikage rethought his.

I do like the theory about him being her dad and Tokiko her mother, but I don't think it was what Ikuko was going for.

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#14 | Back to Top05-22-2009 11:17:28 PM

NajiMinkin
Hacker Ringleader
From: The Incredible Edible Egg
Registered: 06-23-2007
Posts: 2537

Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

Nanami's Rose Groom wrote:

Hey, that theory would solve the fact that in the manga, Utena's aunt, Yurika, looks really much like Mikage... and even smiles in the same , creepy way...

Mmmn. My thought exactly.
But I don't understand why Ikuhara would design a character who seemed to represent Utena herself (in his pursuit of Mamiya reflecting Utena's of Anthy) as so similar to her aunt. It seems like there's no significance whatsoever in Mikage=Aunt.

I'm almost tempted to think that Ikuhara just had a limited repertoire of hair styles; I certainly didn't feel like there was much significance in his giving the parents of the girl in 4 Days in Ohtori the Touga and Nanami hairstyles. Although, I suppose that's not always true... There was certainly some meaning in switching the texture of Utena and Anthy's hair in the movie vs. the series. And Tokiko's similarity to Tatsuya...? They're both kinda similar.

I guess my bottom line is that I don't believe the two of them to be related by blood. I think Utena and Mikage simply mirror each other, looking very similar while being the complete opposite of each other.

As Raven pointed out, the other persons related in Utena seem to look quite different from one another; all of them have different hair colors from those who they are related to.

Last edited by NajiMinkin (05-22-2009 11:18:27 PM)


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#15 | Back to Top05-23-2009 01:43:35 AM

Katzenklavier
Wondrous Sexual Eggplant.
From: Back of your thoughts.
Registered: 09-13-2008
Posts: 1120

Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

I think the visual similarity between Mikage and Utena is meant to accentuate the fact they are dual representations of fixation. As the former noted, both are deeply tied to a specific memory that they refuse to depart from. Only the former is a perversion of the latter; Mikage ruthlessly manipulates and cruelly harms whoever he can to retain his fantasy, while Utena deludes herself into playing the heroine. Where Mikage is cold and intellective, Utena is passionate and lead by her loyalty towards others. They are exact opposites and yet they both have that commonality; a past that engulfs the entirety of their purposes, and the ensuing servitude to Akio. I always believed that the Chairman recognized this parallel and used it to test his little victor.

Damn. Now I want to write a rather naughty fanfic about his views towards both.

As for Mikage being Utena's father...nah. I don't think so. Simply because I couldn't imagine Nemuro fathering a child, or his darker self to create one that he wouldn't use from birth for his own purposes. It is said explicitly that the former was a "dry" man who was incapable of making real connections - until Tokiko and Mamiya, of course. Mikage wouldn't father a child unless it was part of an experiment, and then I highly doubt he'd refrain from mentioning that connection when he was attempting to sway Utena to his view.

I also disagree with you, satyreyes. I think Nemuro was very attracted to Tokiko. She was the first one to make him feel, and it was viewing her liaison with Akio that drove him to mass murder. Additionally, he confessed attraction to Utena, who he repeatedly confused with Tokiko. Mikage belonged to Mamiya, thanks to Anthy's manipulations. Nemuro wholly desired Tokiko.


We must go forward, not backward. Upward, not forward. And always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom.

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#16 | Back to Top05-23-2009 07:49:45 AM

spoon-san
Someday Shiner
Registered: 03-18-2009
Posts: 3423

Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

Well, my initial thoughts are that it could make a quite interesting fanfic at the very least.  I could see Mikage as possibly being an uncle or something of that nature since despite his looks he is actually quite old in comparison to Utena (though since Utena was a little girl when Anthy was little and when Akio was Dios, Utena herself could be quite old so them being cousins or something of sorts is a possibility that would not exactly disrupt the canon universe).  But yeah, it's certainly an idea that can be toyed with while remaining credible.  I haven't really thought of the idea otherwise but saw it in light of symbolism.

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#17 | Back to Top05-25-2009 07:21:08 AM

Hiraku
Easter Elf #40
From: Singapore
Registered: 02-21-2007
Posts: 6340
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Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

Hm... I just don't see that Utena having a part of Dios in her soul to be the case here.

In my opinion, Utena's bravery and nobility, which drew on Dios' power, does not necessarily need to be directly associated to Dios.
True, at some points in the duels, Utena did reminded Anthy of Dios, but if that really is the case, why don't Akio and Anthy just pull out whatever's in Utena that is actually a part of Dios? You can't really take away someone's bravery and nobility... Then again, I think the manga did something in that nature.

I could see how the theory might work with the whole Mikage being Utena's father work, though.

But, one thing might debunk that idea. Why doesn't Mikage see himself in Utena, but Tokiko instead? emot-confused

Last edited by Hiraku (05-25-2009 07:23:26 AM)

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#18 | Back to Top05-26-2009 07:24:19 AM

sharnii
Pharaoh of Phanstuff
From: Melbourne Australia
Registered: 08-10-2008
Posts: 2416
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Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

JelliKatz: I think the visual similarity between Mikage and Utena is meant to accentuate the fact they are dual representations of fixation.

I agree with this. school-eng101

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#19 | Back to Top05-02-2010 06:11:56 PM

Grell Sutcliff
Saionji Slapper
From: Keene, NH
Registered: 04-26-2010
Posts: 25
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Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

It is an interesting idea that Mikage could, somehow, be a possible father for Utena; however, I have to go with what Katzenklavier said about Nemuro being a dry man who was, indeed, a walking computer...until he met Tokiko and Mamiya. It is a funny and interesting idea to run with, but I see Mikage more as a fallen past part of Utena, almost like a shadow or ghost of how Utena would have been if she lived in Nemuro's days, or how she would have been if she had fallen into Akio's traps forever.
The fact that Utena's Aunt Yurika and Mikage look a lot alike was something I did not see before. O_O! Good observation.


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#20 | Back to Top05-03-2010 12:36:35 AM

Ico
Juri Jeerer
From: Over the moon
Registered: 03-30-2010
Posts: 48
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Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

satyreyes wrote:

First, it's not obvious to me that Nemuro was attracted to Tokiko, though she seemed attracted to him; Mamiya seemed more Nemuro's type.

Wut?  Nuuuu.  All right, I realize this comment is a year old (almost exactly!  Minus 17 days), but I can't help myself.  You have compelled to take action in the form of... fanartschool-devil  Because now I think about it, Mikage/Mamiya do seem to get the majority of the artwork together.  By contrast Nemuro's romance with Tokiko seems fairly neglected.

I shall make a cell-shaded image straight out of the anime!  This is officially the first time ever that I've undertaken an Utena fanart (it's long overdue, I guess emot-tongue )  Thanks for the inspiration!

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#21 | Back to Top05-11-2016 02:06:45 PM

ShiningSanctum1
Touga Topper
Registered: 11-23-2012
Posts: 57

Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

I doubt that Mikage was Utena's father. As we see in the episode about his past, he was incapable of love because he didn't understand what it was back then. He was sexually defunct xD He only realized that the feeling was love when he saw Akio and Tokiko together, and burned the building as a result (because he didn't know how to react properly to it). I think he has similarities to Utena (the pink hair, longings, etc) to serve as both a foil AND somewhat of a parallel to Utena. Mikage was incapable of human emotions yet had a naive longing for something just like Utena does, case in point her wanting to become a prince. In my opinion Mikage was not sure of what to do with his feelings since he had poor human communication, so all he could think of was burning down a building or something logical that would end up hurting people to experiment on what he had done wrong. He wanted to look for his mistakes in the fault for others and saw love as rocket science rather than something you could just talk about (sort of like the man in Coldplay's "The Scientist"). Thus he got stuck in that loop, but ended up not being able to get out. So he failed in bringing Revolution because he didn't really have the same willpower that Utena did, and wound up dragging his potential deeper down rather than bring a change. He always tries to bring out the worst out of people he tests out. I know for sure he didn't want to deliberately hurt anybody because he did spare Wakaba's male friend from being one of his subjects. He was picking out the worst of confused students he could find because he saw himself in them. They were simply studies he was conducting for catharsis.
However, Utena is the total opposite. She doesn't know how to give up when struggling for friendship and whatever she fights for. She fights for her wants with valor and gets her way almost all the time due to her genuine display of loyalty. To simply put it, Utena is a truly noble person, while Mikage is not and sort of artificial.

Also people seem to think that Mikage is in love with Mamiya. I disagree. He was in love with Tokiko throughout, even as his "Mikage" persona. To me he was trying to make up for his mistakes by leaning onto Mamiya. He did in his mind pin his blame on him for the burning incident after all. Also it was only out of love for Tokiko. He saw Tokiki in Utena because he was deeply interested in both of them. But the thing he failed to distinguish was the fact that what he felt for Tokiko was pure romantic love, but his interest in Utena was more of something like, "she is the most interesting subject I've seen-maybe I could test her power".


Yesterday is history. Tomorrow is a mystery. Today is a gift. That's why it is called the present.

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#22 | Back to Top05-11-2016 08:41:51 PM

pesimistamente
Anthy Assailer
From: Barcelona [former epi]
Registered: 01-12-2016
Posts: 70

Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

well I wrote this analysis about the symbolism of Nemuro's episodes. The biggest clues about Nemuro being Utena's father is 1. the character design, 2. symbolism with cats and the shadow girls, 3. timeline (Nemuro's storyline being 15 years before Utena's), 4. some other random facts such as ambidiextry in both characters.

If this theory was indeed truth and Nemuro was Utena's father (while Mikage bieng the shadow of Utena's father), then Utena's father would be a 15 year old in the asperger spectrum, abused and manipulated by an adult, while having a sincere love for Mamiya: the younger sibling of the adult who abused him. IT ALMOST SEEMS LIKE WE ARE MEANT TO DRAW PARALELISMS RIGHT?.

It's indeed a tragic theory.

Last edited by pesimistamente (05-11-2016 08:43:34 PM)

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#23 | Back to Top05-11-2016 09:32:18 PM

ShiningSanctum1
Touga Topper
Registered: 11-23-2012
Posts: 57

Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

pesimistamente wrote:

well I wrote this analysis about the symbolism of Nemuro's episodes. The biggest clues about Nemuro being Utena's father is 1. the character design, 2. symbolism with cats and the shadow girls, 3. timeline (Nemuro's storyline being 15 years before Utena's), 4. some other random facts such as ambidiextry in both characters.

If this theory was indeed truth and Nemuro was Utena's father (while Mikage bieng the shadow of Utena's father), then Utena's father would be a 15 year old in the asperger spectrum, abused and manipulated by an adult, while having a sincere love for Mamiya: the younger sibling of the adult who abused him. IT ALMOST SEEMS LIKE WE ARE MEANT TO DRAW PARALELISMS RIGHT?.

It's indeed a tragic theory.

No, to me, Mikage is not her father. He is only meant to be a parallel AND a foil to Utena. They are physically analogous people, and only had the same longing to be trapped in their illusion. In their final battle, Mikage shouts something like, "When I first met you, I knew! You also met someone important to you in the past, didn't you?! And that person changed your life, didn't they? You stand here because of that illusion!" Also, Mikage and Tokiko never really had anything going on. He was in love with her, but he never told her how he felt because he didn't understand what the feeling was. So that's why he's still stuck in his illusion. He used to be some kind of emotionless logic robot until something like that confused him. He's only using Utena to challenge himself. Like I said earlier, he was testing out those Black Rose duelists to kind of conduct an experiment on how you drag the worst of confessions out of people. He tried to think too logically so he ended up being stuck in a loop, in his illusion until Utena kind of set him free (he finally left the school after Utena made him realize that he can't pin his blame on everyone else-he had pinned the burning on Mamiya in the past).

His being very similar to Utena is done intentionally to show how the two are yet so different on the inside. Utena has a positive mindset despite being trapped in her illusion. She says she plays prince but we can see how genuinely she treats her friends with much loyalty. Utena is someone who's truly noble, while Mikage was trying to figure out how to fix everything by manipulating the misery of others. It seems to me he was trying to run a new set of duels, but ended up failing because like the Student Council members, his illusion was love and greed. That's the similarity they share when it comes to losing to Utena.

The reason why he calls Utena Tokiko is due to the fact that he really wanted to see whether he could come to fight his memories. He was kind of using Utena as a form of catharsis/anger output to see whether he could break free?

Last edited by ShiningSanctum1 (05-11-2016 09:34:40 PM)


Yesterday is history. Tomorrow is a mystery. Today is a gift. That's why it is called the present.

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#24 | Back to Top05-11-2016 09:53:50 PM

pesimistamente
Anthy Assailer
From: Barcelona [former epi]
Registered: 01-12-2016
Posts: 70

Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

ShiningSanctum1 wrote:

pesimistamente wrote:

well I wrote this analysis about the symbolism of Nemuro's episodes. The biggest clues about Nemuro being Utena's father is 1. the character design, 2. symbolism with cats and the shadow girls, 3. timeline (Nemuro's storyline being 15 years before Utena's), 4. some other random facts such as ambidiextry in both characters.

If this theory was indeed truth and Nemuro was Utena's father (while Mikage bieng the shadow of Utena's father), then Utena's father would be a 15 year old in the asperger spectrum, abused and manipulated by an adult, while having a sincere love for Mamiya: the younger sibling of the adult who abused him. IT ALMOST SEEMS LIKE WE ARE MEANT TO DRAW PARALELISMS RIGHT?.

It's indeed a tragic theory.

No, to me, Mikage is not her father. He is only meant to be a parallel AND a foil to Utena. They are physically analogous people, and only had the same longing to be trapped in their illusion. In their final battle, Mikage shouts something like, "When I first met you, I knew! You also met someone important to you in the past, didn't you?! And that person changed your life, didn't they? You stand here because of that illusion!" Also, Mikage and Tokiko never really had anything going on. He was in love with her, but he never told her how he felt because he didn't understand what the feeling was. So that's why he's still stuck in his illusion. He used to be some kind of emotionless logic robot until something like that confused him. He's only using Utena to challenge himself. Like I said earlier, he was testing out those Black Rose duelists to kind of conduct an experiment on how you drag the worst of confessions out of people. He tried to think too logically so he ended up being stuck in a loop, in his illusion until Utena kind of set him free (he finally left the school after Utena made him realize that he can't pin his blame on everyone else-he had pinned the burning on Mamiya in the past).

His being very similar to Utena is done intentionally to show how the two are yet so different on the inside. Utena has a positive mindset despite being trapped in her illusion. She says she plays prince but we can see how genuinely she treats her friends with much loyalty. Utena is someone who's truly noble, while Mikage was trying to figure out how to fix everything by manipulating the misery of others. It seems to me he was trying to run a new set of duels, but ended up failing because like the Student Council members, his illusion was love and greed. That's the similarity they share when it comes to losing to Utena.

The reason why he calls Utena Tokiko is due to the fact that he really wanted to see whether he could come to fight his memories. He was kind of using Utena as a form of catharsis/anger output to see whether he could break free?

Sure, Mikage and Utena have strong paralelism with eachother but that on its own doesn't really explain why Tokiko also has a design similar to Utena. It doesn't really explain the shadow girls' dialogue where they talk about the relationship between a father and a daughter competing, the cats symbolism and breeding, or the pink suitcase that Tokiko takes with her after she leaves Ohtori.

Nemuro and Utena have paralelism, that's true, but there's an undeniable amount of clues that point to more directions. In order to say "NO, THIS IS IMPOSSIBLE" we should come to a different conclusion for all those clues without simply ignoring them.

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#25 | Back to Top05-16-2016 01:11:46 PM

DefineMask
Saionji Slapper
Registered: 05-14-2016
Posts: 26

Re: Could Utena and Mikage Possibly Be Related?

I agree with pessimistamente. It's kind of obvious that Nemuro is related to Utena. Same pink hair, the timeline, and a similar personality. They both are trapped in their fantasies. Like father, like daughter. Conveniently, Nemuro and Tokiko's meeting took 15 years ago, which is enough for Tokiko to have conceived Utena (Utena is 14, 9 months=pop comes out the baby). Also is it me or does Tokiko look oddly a lot, and I mean a LOT like Utena. They share the same hairline and face.


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Episode 22 Notes: Also the teacup that shows up at times imply that Nemuro and Tokiko shared an intimate relationship. Also note that Akio drops the ring into the teacup at some point, and a lady resembling Tokiko walks away with a big pink bag.

Note that Ikuhara and Hideaki Anno, the creator of Evangelion, were great friends. Shinji's mom looks a lot like Tokiko and Gendo nearly has the same robotic personality that Nemuro does. So there's also that obvious parallel.

Also when OLDER Tokiko comes to Akio, she mentions something about a plant bearing fruit.

Last edited by DefineMask (05-16-2016 01:13:24 PM)

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